This is so useless. You would find a hair to split on Yule Brynner's
head.


On Oct 7, 1:52*pm, samsloan wrote:
On Oct 7, 2:44*pm, wrote:





On Oct 7, 2:30*pm, samsloan wrote:

On Oct 7, 2:17*pm, wrote:

On Oct 7, 6:34*am, samsloan wrote:

On Oct 6, 11:34*pm, samsloan wrote:

Take a look at:http://susanpolgar.blogspot.com/2008/10/spice-cup.html

Through her ubiquitous "anonymous" posters, Susan Polgar is attacking
the New York Times, demanding that its reporter be fired.

He had better watch out. Next thing, Susan Polgar will sue his ass,
claiming that he is persecuting her because she is a woman and of
foreign descent.

Sam Sloan

Also, take a look athttp://www.chessdiscussion.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1526

Under the header "Questionable journalism?"
Susan Polgar and Gregory Alexander are attacking the New York Times
for "nit-picking".

Sam Sloan

* What is the NY Times reporter's source for his statement that "Texas
Tech said the Spice Cup was the strongest invitational tournament to
be held in the United States"? Who at Texas Tech said this, when,
where? Did any such statement actually appear anywhere under Texas
Tech auspices?
* It does not appear that Polgar herself has issued any such
statement; rather, she said "the 2008 SPICE Cup [will be] the highest
rated 10 person International RR event in U.S. history." That's not at
all the same thing as McClain reports.

The New York Times quoted a press release from Texas Tech that has
been on the USCF website since July 10, 2008. If this was wrong Susan
had an obligation as a USCF Board member and as director of the SPICE
Program to correct it:

http://main.uschess.org/content/view/8558/319/

* Couldn't get that link to work.

2008 SPICE Cup to Break Records * * * * * Print * * * * * E-mail
By Cory Chandler
July 12, 2008
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
DATE: July 10, 2008
CONTACT: Cory Chandler,
(806) 742-2136

2008 SPICE Cup is the Highest Rated 10-player International Round-
Robin in U.S. History

Texas Tech University’s Susan Polgar Institute for Chess Excellence
announced Thursday it has assembled the strongest field of chess
grandmasters in U.S. round-robin history for its 2008 SPICE Cup
International Invitational Tournament.

* *Hmmm, I see. Thank you. The headline is accurate, but the sentence
following is highly questionable.

Right, it says:

Texas Tech University’s Susan Polgar Institute for Chess Excellence
announced Thursday it has assembled the strongest field of chess
grandmasters in U.S. round-robin history.

US history starts in 1789. The USCF rating system started in 1950 and
the FIDE rating system started in 1970.

If the announcement said that it was "the highest rated tournament
under the FIDE rating system since 1970" few would have disputed it.

Sam Sloan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Oct 13, 4:33*pm, Rob wrote:
This is so useless. You would find a hair to split on Yule Brynner's
head.

That is absolutely true, but remember that it was Susan Polgar, whom
you generally support, who started this debate by repeatedly attacking
the New York Times reporter over this issue.

Sam Sloan

"samsloan" wrote in message
...
On Oct 13, 4:33 pm, Rob wrote:
This is so useless. You would find a hair to split on Yule Brynner's
head.

That is absolutely true, but remember that it was Susan Polgar, whom
you generally support, who started this debate by repeatedly attacking
the New York Times reporter over this issue.

**Attacking, says Sloan, by stating that they were wrong, as wrong as USCF,
Sloan - get it? Do you get that 10,000 posts about Susan Polgar equals [for
better or worse] an obsession on your part? And why would a justice not wish
to know this, whether you have a ligitmate argument or the usual trash?

Phil Innes



Sam Sloan

On Oct 13, 5:57*pm, "Chess One" wrote:
"samsloan" wrote in message

...
On Oct 13, 4:33 pm, Rob wrote:

This is so useless. You would find a hair to split on Yule Brynner's
head.

That is absolutely true, but remember that it was Susan Polgar, whom
you generally support, who started this debate by repeatedly attacking
the New York Times reporter over this issue.

**Attacking, says Sloan, by stating that they were wrong, as wrong as USCF,
Sloan - get it? Do you get that 10,000 posts about Susan Polgar equals [for
better or worse] an obsession on your part? And why would a justice not wish
to know this, whether you have a ligitmate argument or the usual trash?

Phil Innes

The New York Times was not wrong. The New York Times was correct. A
press release by Texas Tech University stated that the SPICE Cup held
in Lubbock Texas was the strongest chess tournament ever in the
history of the United States.

That was not true. There have been at least four tournaments that were
stronger.

Susan Polgar would do well to leave this issue alone. Every time she
brings it up, she goes that much deeper in the hole.

Sam Sloan

On Oct 13, 6:51 pm, Mike Murray wrote:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 15:22:44 -0400, "Chess One"
wrote:

Name 5-yr peak 1-1-1978
Spassky: 2680 2630
Larsen: ----- 2620
Portisch: ----- 2630
Unzicker: 2590 2525
Petrosian: 2680 2620
Najdorf: 2635 2525
Ivkov: 2570 2515
Donner: 2500 2490
**Therefore, even with these retro-ratings, and even with some players
assessed at their peak, the last 3 players seriously reduce the Category
rating to less tha XV, - these 8 players average 2,569 in '78 - and even
given these means the current SPICE XV stands as being correct as highest.

So what does "highest" mean?

The number of players in the rating pool is much larger now than in
1978, which makes it almost certain that many more players will be
rated above 2600 (or "x"). Unless the distribution changed in the 20
intervening years, this would be true even the current crop of GMs
played at a *lower* level of absolute strength than the GMs of 1978.

The fact is the competitors at Santa Monica represented a much greater
sampling of truly world-class players than did those in this year's
Spice Cup.

So, the often repeated claim of "highest rated" may be true (but
slightly misleading in implication), but the single claim of
"strongest" cannot be sustained.

The comparison is more extreme than that.

The higest rated player in the SPICE Cup was Harikrishna, rated 2659.
Second highest was Onischuk, rated 2644.

Harikrishna is ranked number 62 in the world. Onischuk is ranked
number 82 in the world.

None of the other players in the SPICE Cup were in the top 100 in the
world.

http://ratings.fide.com/top.phtml?list=men

By comparison, ALL of the players in both the First and the Second
Piatigorsky Cup either were in the top 20 in the world or had been in
the top 20 in the world at some time in the past.

In short, ALL of the players in either of the two Piatagorsky Cups
were or had been "World Class" players. NONE of the players in the
SPICE Cup have ever been World Class players.

None of this should distract from the fact that Susan Polgar has
accomplished a great and beneficial thing by putting together this
tournament. However, she ruins it by attacking the New York Times
after the Times correctly pointed out that Zsuzsa's tournament was NOT
the strongest tournament ever played in the USA.

Sam Sloan

"samsloan" wrote in message
...
On Oct 13, 6:51 pm, Mike Murray wrote:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 15:22:44 -0400, "Chess One"
wrote:

Name 5-yr peak 1-1-1978
Spassky: 2680 2630
Larsen: ----- 2620
Portisch: ----- 2630
Unzicker: 2590 2525
Petrosian: 2680 2620
Najdorf: 2635 2525
Ivkov: 2570 2515
Donner: 2500 2490
**Therefore, even with these retro-ratings, and even with some players
assessed at their peak, the last 3 players seriously reduce the Category
rating to less tha XV, - these 8 players average 2,569 in '78 - and
even
given these means the current SPICE XV stands as being correct as
highest.

So what does "highest" mean?

The number of players in the rating pool is much larger now than in
1978, which makes it almost certain that many more players will be
rated above 2600 (or "x"). Unless the distribution changed in the 20
intervening years, this would be true even the current crop of GMs
played at a *lower* level of absolute strength than the GMs of 1978.

The fact is the competitors at Santa Monica represented a much greater
sampling of truly world-class players than did those in this year's
Spice Cup.

So, the often repeated claim of "highest rated" may be true (but
slightly misleading in implication), but the single claim of
"strongest" cannot be sustained.

The comparison is more extreme than that.

The comparison of what? When a subject begins as the strongest tournament
*category*, then this means the average of the players' ratings which
determine the tournament level.

Here we have the Sloan switching topics to individual ratings of /some/ of
the players - and a little below he switches yet again to not-ratings, but
world positions - either current ones or

"...at some time in the past".

I can only assume that the NY Times are reading the Sloan somewhere and not
the Polgar everywhere else, or in fact, asking USCF people any questions
about what they report - or contain anyone with knowledge of what a
tournament is on their staff.

In which case why not compare the SPICE event with Lone Pine or even
Cambridge Springs since what is being compared continuously shifts even to
"...some time in the past", and now its about 'world class players' not
category of tournament.

Naturally, Sam Sloan does not think he is attacking anything here, except
the literal truth - its other people who are doing the attacking, the people
who merely say what a Category rating is - and to which Sam Sloan is
entirely wrong.

The Sloan has stated that he is not obsessed by Susan Polgar, despite the
evidence of his 10,00 posts about her - I think its therfore equitable to
grant him that he is not obssessed with being correct either.

The very strange thing here is that he submitted his 'argument' to a justice
in order that that the person should compare what he says with what who he
accuses says.


Phil Innes

The higest rated player in the SPICE Cup was Harikrishna, rated 2659.
Second highest was Onischuk, rated 2644.

Harikrishna is ranked number 62 in the world. Onischuk is ranked
number 82 in the world.

None of the other players in the SPICE Cup were in the top 100 in the
world.

http://ratings.fide.com/top.phtml?list=men

By comparison, ALL of the players in both the First and the Second
Piatigorsky Cup either were in the top 20 in the world or had been in
the top 20 in the world at some time in the past.

In short, ALL of the players in either of the two Piatagorsky Cups
were or had been "World Class" players. NONE of the players in the
SPICE Cup have ever been World Class players.

None of this should distract from the fact that Susan Polgar has
accomplished a great and beneficial thing by putting together this
tournament. However, she ruins it by attacking the New York Times
after the Times correctly pointed out that Zsuzsa's tournament was NOT
the strongest tournament ever played in the USA.

Sam Sloan

On Oct 14, 11:19*am, "Chess One" wrote:

The comparison of what? When a subject begins as the strongest tournament
*category*, then this means the average of the players' ratings which
determine the tournament level.

Here we have the Sloan switching topics to individual ratings of /some/ of
the players - and a little below he switches yet again to not-ratings, but
world positions - either current ones or

* * "...at some time in the past".

I can only assume that the NY Times are reading the Sloan somewhere and not
the Polgar everywhere else, or in fact, asking USCF people any questions
about what they report - or contain anyone with knowledge of what a
tournament is on their staff.

In which case why not compare the SPICE event with Lone Pine or even
Cambridge Springs since what is being compared continuously shifts even to
"...some time in the past", and now its about 'world class players' not
category of tournament.

Naturally, Sam Sloan does not think he is attacking anything here, except
the literal truth - its other people who are doing the attacking, the people
who merely say what a Category rating is - and to which Sam Sloan is
entirely wrong.

The Sloan has stated that he is not obsessed by Susan Polgar, despite the
evidence of his 10,00 posts about her - I think its therfore equitable to
grant him that he is not obssessed with being correct either.

The very strange thing here is that he submitted his 'argument' to a justice
in order that that the person should compare what he says with what who he
accuses says.

Phil Innes

The press release issued by Texas Tech University stated:

"Texas Tech University’s Susan Polgar Institute for Chess Excellence
announced Thursday it has assembled the strongest field of chess
grandmasters in U.S. round-robin history for its 2008 SPICE Cup
International Invitational Tournament."

This statement was not true as there have been at least four
tournaments stronger than that.

Now, Susan Polgar and Phil Innes are relentlessly attacking the New
York Times for making this true statement.

Probably next time the New York Times and other major media will
simply no longer report on any event involving Susan Polgar.

Sam Sloan