A Chess forum. ChessBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » ChessBanter forum » Chess Newsgroups » rec.games.chess.analysis (Chess Analysis)
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

How do you like Caro-Kann?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old July 3rd 03, 11:56 AM
Jenö Nyerges
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

Hello chess afficionados,

I ask this because i really enjoy playing Caro.Not that i really know
much about it, i just acquired a certain feeling by looking at master
games and observing 2100+ players in my club playing it often.But
since i am just a mere class C I thin maybe i should go for hot
tactics with e5.Having white I like to set the board on fire with the
scotch and i alos love the sicilian.Maybe I shouldnt play
1..c6.Anyway, I post this to get feedback from low rated players like
me (around 1400) who use the caro-kann.


Jenö Nyerges

"Hic locus vere amoenus est"
  #2  
Old July 3rd 03, 02:33 PM
Dwight Beers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

On Thu, 03 Jul 2003 02:56:51 -0700, Jenö Nyerges wrote:

Hello chess afficionados,

I ask this because i really enjoy playing Caro.Not that i really know
much about it, i just acquired a certain feeling by looking at master
games and observing 2100+ players in my club playing it often.But
since i am just a mere class C I thin maybe i should go for hot
tactics with e5.Having white I like to set the board on fire with the
scotch and i alos love the sicilian.Maybe I shouldnt play
1..c6.Anyway, I post this to get feedback from low rated players like
me (around 1400) who use the caro-kann.


Jenö Nyerges

"Hic locus vere amoenus est"


I sometimes think the Caro-Kann should be called the Hungarian Defense,
since so many Hungarians seem to play it, but that hasn't stopped this
American from playing it(at least most of the time).

  #3  
Old July 3rd 03, 02:47 PM
Fred Henderson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?


"Burkart Venzke" wrote in message
...

"Roman M. Parparov" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser than Class A
players and not always even by them.


Why do you think so?

Burkart


Mr. Parparov has many times shared his views on Caro-Kann for class players.
Let me see if I have learned my lesson.

In a nutshell, a CK player frequently has to defend passive positions, or
defend against an enduring initiative. Very few players at the class level
know how to play such positions. People should not play openings that lead
to positions they don't understand. Therefore Class players shouldn't play
the Caro-Kann.

Do I have it right Mr. P.?


Fred.




  #4  
Old July 3rd 03, 03:56 PM
Andreas Walkenhorst
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

On Thu, 3 Jul 2003 11:10:13 +0000 (UTC), "Roman M. Parparov"
wrote:

[snip]
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser than Class A
players and not always even by them.


I really disagree here. We showed it to a young guy in my club who -
though only 16 at that time had a good feeling for positional play,
and severe weaknesses in tactics.
He insisted more or less to learn either the French or the Caro-Kann
(don't ask me why g)
Though he played chess for some years then, he began to take it
serious (in terms of learning theory etc) at that time.
This was about 18 months ago. He did not have a rating then and had
just played about 10 OTB games.
Today he is rated about 1800, and the combination of the Caro-Kann
and the Slav gave him a reasonable and safe opening repertoire.
He is improving very rapidly, so I guess that he will cross the 2000
this or next year. and it would be much faster I guess if he were a
bit less lazy :-)
As we insisted that he does tactic excercises, he begins to feel
better in sharp positions now. Likely that he changes to another
opening. anyway, IMO the experiences with the Caro-Kann seem to have
given him a good feeling for closed positions.
In contrast to most people in this NG I am completely convinced that
one needs to learn "positional" play very early. I think that you can
much more easy improve in tactics than in positional play, mo matter
how old you are. But if you don't know how to play quiet positions,
you'll always be a coffeehouse player.
I think the Caro-Kann is a very "natural" opening, the development of
the pieces happens generally in a very harmonic way. It is safe and
sound, so why not play it, no matter at what level you are.

Andreas

  #5  
Old July 3rd 03, 05:54 PM
John Lamont
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

Well back when I was a 1400ish player I would play the caro-kann on
occaision, and there's nothing really wrong with it, if you enjoy it
by all means play it.. but one problem I ran into was that while I
could use it to positionally grind out wins against lower rated
players like clockwork, I would simply get crushed by higher rated
players, and in neither case would I learn anything to improve (or
reinforce) my skill in tactics, which is what you need at this level
to reach higher ranks..
  #6  
Old July 3rd 03, 06:13 PM
Roman M. Parparov
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

Fred Henderson wrote:

"Burkart Venzke" wrote in message
...

"Roman M. Parparov" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser than Class A
players and not always even by them.


Why do you think so?

Burkart


Mr. Parparov has many times shared his views on Caro-Kann for class players.
Let me see if I have learned my lesson.

In a nutshell, a CK player frequently has to defend passive positions, or
defend against an enduring initiative. Very few players at the class level
know how to play such positions. People should not play openings that lead
to positions they don't understand. Therefore Class players shouldn't play
the Caro-Kann.

Do I have it right Mr. P.?


Fred.

Absolutely right. And I am a CK player with 16 years of experience.

--
Roman M. Parparov - NASA EOSDIS project node at TAU technical manager.
Email: http://www.nasa.proj.ac.il
Phone/Fax: +972-(0)3-6405205 (work), +972-(0)64-669-189 (home)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The economy depends about as much on economists as the weather does on
weather forecasters.
-- Jean-Paul Kauffmann
  #7  
Old July 3rd 03, 09:52 PM
Ivan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

After Black defends the enduring initiative/passive position, what
happens next, is black winning the game ?


"Fred Henderson" wrote in message . ..
"Burkart Venzke" wrote in message
...

"Roman M. Parparov" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser than Class A
players and not always even by them.


Why do you think so?

Burkart


Mr. Parparov has many times shared his views on Caro-Kann for class players.
Let me see if I have learned my lesson.

In a nutshell, a CK player frequently has to defend passive positions, or
defend against an enduring initiative. Very few players at the class level
know how to play such positions. People should not play openings that lead
to positions they don't understand. Therefore Class players shouldn't play
the Caro-Kann.

Do I have it right Mr. P.?


Fred.

  #8  
Old July 3rd 03, 10:35 PM
Casey
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

"Fred Henderson" wrote in message . ..
"Burkart Venzke" wrote in message
...

"Roman M. Parparov" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser than Class A
players and not always even by them.


Why do you think so?

Burkart


Mr. Parparov has many times shared his views on Caro-Kann for class players.
Let me see if I have learned my lesson.

In a nutshell, a CK player frequently has to defend passive positions, or
defend against an enduring initiative. Very few players at the class level
know how to play such positions. People should not play openings that lead
to positions they don't understand. Therefore Class players shouldn't play
the Caro-Kann.

Do I have it right Mr. P.?


Fred.


Like buying a stock, never base a judgement on a single person's views.
  #9  
Old July 3rd 03, 10:51 PM
Mark Houlsby
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

Ivan wrote:
After Black defends the enduring initiative/passive position, what
happens next, is black winning the game ?


No, drawing. Of course, if white goes wrong then black is winning...


--
Direct access to this group with http://web2news.com
http://web2news.com/?rec.games.chess.analysis
  #10  
Old July 4th 03, 04:43 AM
rbauer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How do you like Caro-Kann?

Roman M. Parparov wrote:
Fred Henderson wrote:

"Burkart Venzke" wrote in message
...

"Roman M. Parparov" schrieb
im Newsbeitrag
...
CK is a very difficult opening, unfit to play by lesser
than Class A
players and not always even by them.

Why do you think so?

Burkart

Mr. Parparov has many times shared his views on Caro-Kann
for class players.
Let me see if I have learned my lesson.

In a nutshell, a CK player frequently has to defend
passive positions, or
defend against an enduring initiative. Very few players
at the class level
know how to play such positions. People should not play
openings that lead
to positions they don't understand. Therefore Class
players shouldn't play
the Caro-Kann.

etc..
Absolutely right. And I am a CK player with 16 years of experience.


While I am not a CK player, I've found these pronouncements over the
years to be a bit rigid. For one thing, I've known players who, even at
lower levels, were perfectly adept at playing those sorts of passive
positions and getting reasonable chances. Second, I've heard the same
thing about the Sicilian - you can't play it at lower levels because it
generally requires strong defensive ability and willingness to soak up
white's initiative. I've heard the same about Alekhines, and the
Modern, and this and that to the point that there is nothing left. When
I ask players who have this position, they say black should play 1...e5.
I ask you - are there not Ruy Lopen and King's Gambit positions where
black similarly has to soak up the white initiative and perhaps play a
passive position with the hope that white will overreach?

So what exactly is black supposed to play?

I think he should play what he is comfortable with, learn it well, grow
with it throughout his career, and not worry about whether he is strong
enough to supposedly play it well.

Randy Bauer

--
Direct access to this group with http://web2news.com
http://web2news.com/?rec.games.chess.analysis
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 2.4.0
Copyright ©2004-2017 ChessBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.