J.D. Walker wrote:
Anders Thulin wrote:
samsloan wrote:

Where exactly? I have searched http://www.bookfinder.com and I cannot
find even one.

There's this selection box with 'Books written in
(Dutch|English|French|German|Italian)' that you have to use in the
right manner.

I mean, really no point in searching for 'Handbuch des Schachspiels'
among books
written in English or French, is there?


Well, there is some point to it. You can find English, and presumably
French, texts that refer to it. This may or may not be useful.

I retract my statement since that search engine does not do search of
text contents... Sorry about that.
--

"Do that which is right..."

Rev. J.D. Walker

On Jun 1, 11:37 am, Anders Thulin
wrote:
samsloan wrote:
Where exactly? I have searchedhttp://www.bookfinder.comand I cannot
find even one.

There's this selection box with 'Books written in
(Dutch|English|French|German|Italian)' that you have to use in the right manner.

I mean, really no point in searching for 'Handbuch des Schachspiels' among books
written in English or French, is there?

--
Anders Thulin anders*thulin.name http://www.anders.thulin.name/

I have searched the German Language site of http://www.bookfinder.com
and nowhere is the 1880 edition of Bilguer's Handbuch available. There
is available a Jahre 1916-1929 edition but that would be of much less
interest than an 1880 original.

I know that the copy I have on my desk is an 1880 original because it
has a handwritten letter in it dated 1881.

I have not found anywhere in the world another copy of the 1880
original and I have searched bookstores, libraries, collections and
everywhere else that I can think of.

Sam Sloan

The Deed is Done.

The book has just been sent to my printer.

Sam Sloan

Why is everyone jumping on Sloan for this? The book is obviously out
of copyright, and it's a rare item worth reprinting. It's not like
anyone's forcing you to buy it. (And I don't think anyone would accuse
_me_ of being unduly pro-Sloan.)

From the Oxford Companion:
"Besides the first edition von der Lasa edited the next four (1852,
18956, 1864, 1874). The sixth edition (1880) by Constantin Schwede
(1854-1917) was distinguished by a history derived from van der Linde,
the seventh (1891) by Emil Schallopp (1843-1919) benefited from the
assistance of Berger and L. Paulsen, and the final edition (1916-1921)
by Schlechter included major contributions from Berger, Otto Gustav
Koch (1849-1919), Kohtz, Spielmann, Tarrasch, and Teichmann."

On Jun 3, 9:24 pm, wrote:

Why is everyone jumping on Sloan for this?

Mr. Sloan is widely disliked. Also, he was not
particularly careful in specifying that it was the
*specific edition* that is allegedly rare, not the
book in general (reprinted by Olms). On top of
that, Mr. Sloan tossed out the assertion that
Mr. Bilguer was one of the strongest chess
players in the world... a factoid plucked from
out of the blue (at best).


The book is obviously out of copyright,

....which is probably why nobody here attacked
Mr. Sloan for plagiarism.


and it's a rare item worth reprinting. It's not like
anyone's forcing you to buy it.

Why should anyone buy this particular edition,
as opposed to others? Or as opposed to the
many alternatives? Mr. Sloan does not address
such questions, but instead launches wacky
"strongest" and "extremely rare" marketing
tricks.


(And I don't think anyone would accuse
_me_ of being unduly pro-Sloan.)

Who cares? That would be /ad hominem/...
and nobody around here would stoop that low,
would they? Of course not.

What I find more interesting than any particular
edition of one such book, are the analytical
disagreements between famous players of that
era. Never mind all that has been written and
"tested" since then; we now have extremely
objective arbiters of sorts, in computers. In fact,
they are so objective that they may sometimes
side against *all* the old-time analysts, preferring
some alternative that none of them had even
considered. As for strength, well, how patient
are you? Patient enough to allow some super-
duty middle game possibilities to be worked out
overnight? From what I've seen thus far, some
chess engines are superior overall to even the
strongest human analysts, in addition to being
completely unbiased.

I think one can learn more from a careful
examination of some of these old "discussions"
than from merely acquiring a thick tabulation of
/supposedly/ best moves.

And I also think that relatively few people will
actually buy such a reprint as this one, so
either TK was wrong to suggest that Mr. Sloan's
true motive was money, or else Mr. Sloan may
just not be very bright in that area.


-- help bot

On Jun 2, 10:28 pm, samsloan wrote:

I have searched the German Language site ofhttp://www.bookfinder.com
and nowhere is the 1880 edition of Bilguer's Handbuch available.

Quick repeat: Search for 'Handbuch des schachspiels', first hit I get
is for Bilguer: Handbuch des schachspiels (no year) along with a
number of
other hits. Select that one. On second page I find one (or is it two)
entries
from Antiquariat Querido, and one from Antiquariat Bucherwelt for the
1880 edition.


Of course, things change from day to day, so I can't promise they
still will be
there tomorrow.

And as to 'not found anywhere in the world', I check out www.abebooks.com
for the title, restrict hits to 1880, and out pops both the Querido
book,
and one from Sinnewerk (bookshop in Berlin).

On Jun 3, 9:24*pm, wrote:
Why is everyone jumping on Sloan for this? The book is obviously out
of copyright, and it's a rare item worth reprinting. It's not like
anyone's forcing you to buy it. (And I don't think anyone would accuse
_me_ of being unduly pro-Sloan.)

I don't see that anyone in this thread "jumped" on Sloan for
publishing the book. Rather, I and others took exception to various
inaccurate statements Sloan made pertaining to the book. Nothing new
there; usually Sam can't say three things without being wrong on at
least one or two of them.

From the Oxford Companion:
"Besides the first edition von der Lasa edited the next four (1852,
18956, 1864, 1874). The sixth edition (1880) by Constantin Schwede
(1854-1917) was distinguished by a history derived from van der Linde,
the seventh (1891) by Emil Schallopp (1843-1919) benefited from the
assistance of Berger and L. Paulsen, and the final edition (1916-1921)
by Schlechter included major contributions from Berger, Otto Gustav
Koch (1849-1919), Kohtz, Spielmann, Tarrasch, and Teichmann."

On Jun 4, 9:05 am, " wrote:
On Jun 2, 10:28 pm, samsloan wrote:

I have searched the German Language site ofhttp://www.bookfinder.com
and nowhere is the 1880 edition of Bilguer's Handbuch available.

Quick repeat: Search for 'Handbuch des schachspiels', first hit I get
is for Bilguer: Handbuch des schachspiels (no year) along with a
number of
other hits. Select that one. On second page I find one (or is it two)
entries
from Antiquariat Querido, and one from Antiquariat Bucherwelt for the
1880 edition.

Of course, things change from day to day, so I can't promise they
still will be
there tomorrow.

And as to 'not found anywhere in the world', I check outwww.abebooks.com
for the title, restrict hits to 1880, and out pops both the Querido
book,
and one from Sinnewerk (bookshop in Berlin).

Perhaps you should have mentioned that the price they are charging for
the book is $384.25

http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Book...D61%26y%3D1 2

I plan to charge a bit less for my reprint.

Also, it seems uncertain that they are offering the same book. I
realize that they say 1880 but there is nothing else to indicate that
it is the same edition as I am reprinting.

Sam Sloan
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891404

"samsloan" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
On Jun 4, 9:05 am, " wrote:
On Jun 2, 10:28 pm, samsloan wrote:

I have searched the German Language site ofhttp://www.bookfinder.com
and nowhere is the 1880 edition of Bilguer's Handbuch available.

Quick repeat: Search for 'Handbuch des schachspiels', first hit I get
is for Bilguer: Handbuch des schachspiels (no year) along with a
number of
other hits. Select that one. On second page I find one (or is it two)
entries
from Antiquariat Querido, and one from Antiquariat Bucherwelt for the
1880 edition.

Of course, things change from day to day, so I can't promise they
still will be
there tomorrow.

And as to 'not found anywhere in the world', I check outwww.abebooks.com
for the title, restrict hits to 1880, and out pops both the Querido
book,
and one from Sinnewerk (bookshop in Berlin).

Perhaps you should have mentioned that the price they are charging for
the book is $384.25

http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Book...D61%26y%3D1 2

I plan to charge a bit less for my reprint.

Also, it seems uncertain that they are offering the same book. I
realize that they say 1880 but there is nothing else to indicate that
it is the same edition as I am reprinting.

Presumably because can read neither the seller's description
nor 'your' book. LOL - an illiterate publisher!

He is selling an original 6th edition printed 1880 in good condition.
You are selling a xeroxed glue-bound copy of what you think
is an 1880 editionh. There had better be a price difference.

There is nothing special about the 6th edition. Somebody who
collects such books would probably be looking for the 1st, the
5th (the last one edited by von der Lasa) or the 8th (the last
and most authoritative).

help bot wrote:
On Jun 3, 9:24 pm, wrote:

Why is everyone jumping on Sloan for this?

Mr. Sloan is widely disliked. Also, he was not
particularly careful in specifying that it was the
*specific edition* that is allegedly rare, not the
book in general (reprinted by Olms). On top of
that, Mr. Sloan tossed out the assertion that
Mr. Bilguer was one of the strongest chess
players in the world... a factoid plucked from
out of the blue (at best).


You mentioned (well, will mention below) _ad hominem_? The fact that
Sloan is an unpleasant character has/should have nothing to do with
the merits or otherwise of reprinting the book.



and it's a rare item worth reprinting. It's not like
anyone's forcing you to buy it.

Why should anyone buy this particular edition,
as opposed to others? Or as opposed to the
many alternatives? Mr. Sloan does not address
such questions, but instead launches wacky
"strongest" and "extremely rare" marketing
tricks.


No one has to. That was my point, which seems to have escaped you.
Antiquarians and book collectors might want it. Since it's not a mass-
market item, the marketing tricks are meaningless. And Sloan was
correct that the item is "extremely rare."


(And I don't think anyone would accuse
_me_ of being unduly pro-Sloan.)

Who cares? That would be /ad hominem/...
and nobody around here would stoop that low,
would they? Of course not.


If one of Sloan's friends or supporters speaks in his favor, it can
fairly be discounted. If one of his harshest critics says that you and
your cronies are out of line in attacking him on this, that's another
matter.



What I find more interesting than any particular
edition of one such book, are the analytical
disagreements between famous players of that
era. Never mind all that has been written and
"tested" since then; we now have extremely
objective arbiters of sorts, in computers. In fact,
they are so objective that they may sometimes
side against *all* the old-time analysts, preferring
some alternative that none of them had even
considered. As for strength, well, how patient
are you? Patient enough to allow some super-
duty middle game possibilities to be worked out
overnight? From what I've seen thus far, some
chess engines are superior overall to even the
strongest human analysts, in addition to being
completely unbiased.


Your adulation for computers is well known and not very interesting.



And I also think that relatively few people will
actually buy such a reprint as this one, so
either TK was wrong to suggest that Mr. Sloan's
true motive was money, or else Mr. Sloan may
just not be very bright in that area.


-- help bot


The first statement is obviously correct, but since his costs are
quite low he will presumably make a small profit. Nothing wrong with
that.