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Program that provides numerical evals??



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 24th 03, 02:14 PM
Countrywide Computers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Program that provides numerical evals??

In article , joe
mccarron writes
Hello
I wanted to know what if any programs analysis provides the numerical
eval of the move it suggests *and* the numerical value of the move
played in a game. I need a program that I can compare exactly how
much better the computer thinks its recomended move is than the one
played. Do any any programs provide both of the evaluations once it
is done analyzing?

I don't think fritz does this. After full analysis it gives at best
the informant style symbols for the lines it suggests and sometimes
for the lines played. I would like the *numbers* for all of its its
recomended moves and all of the moves played.

Anyone know if I can get this from Hiarcs Junior Tiger Rebel, cm or
any other program?

Thank you in advance for your help.
Joe


The Rebel programs did this in after-game analysis, but that is/was a
DOS program and no new versions have come out for a year or so making it
difficult to get hold of.

You get a SIMILAR but not exact result with Fritz, Junior & co if you
use BLUNDERCHECK and keep the Threshold figure pretty low to make sure
most/all moves get evaluated for any differences.

Eric
--
Eric Hallsworth for Countrywide Computers Ltd
Victoria House, 1 High Street, Wilburton, Cambs CB6 3RB, U.K.
Tel: 01353 740323
Computer Chess web pages+photos... http://www.elhchess.demon.co.uk
  #2  
Old July 24th 03, 04:55 PM
Dr. Robert Faurisson
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Posts: n/a
Default Program that provides numerical evals??



"joe mccarron" wrote in message
om...
Hello
I wanted to know what if any programs analysis provides the numerical
eval of the move it suggests *and* the numerical value of the move
played in a game. I need a program that I can compare exactly how
much better the computer thinks its recomended move is than the one
played.


Do the math moron! This is something a young child could figure out. You
enter the position one move before the move you want to analyze. You open
the required amount of lines in Fritz untill one of them is the move ..err
blunder in your case..... that was played, and you compare the evaluation
for that move with the evaluation for what Fritz considers the candidate
move. IN OTHER WORDS, YOU SUBTRACT. Is that simple enough for you to grasp?

snipped the rest of this idiots drivel [...bla bla bla...]


  #3  
Old July 24th 03, 06:49 PM
Mike Ogush
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Program that provides numerical evals??

On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 14:14:09 +0100, Countrywide Computers
wrote:

In article , joe
mccarron writes
Hello
I wanted to know what if any programs analysis provides the numerical
eval of the move it suggests *and* the numerical value of the move
played in a game. I need a program that I can compare exactly how
much better the computer thinks its recomended move is than the one
played. Do any any programs provide both of the evaluations once it
is done analyzing?

I don't think fritz does this. After full analysis it gives at best
the informant style symbols for the lines it suggests and sometimes
for the lines played. I would like the *numbers* for all of its its
recomended moves and all of the moves played.

Anyone know if I can get this from Hiarcs Junior Tiger Rebel, cm or
any other program?

Thank you in advance for your help.
Joe


The Rebel programs did this in after-game analysis, but that is/was a
DOS program and no new versions have come out for a year or so making it
difficult to get hold of.

You get a SIMILAR but not exact result with Fritz, Junior & co if you
use BLUNDERCHECK and keep the Threshold figure pretty low to make sure
most/all moves get evaluated for any differences.

Eric
--
Eric Hallsworth for Countrywide Computers Ltd
Victoria House, 1 High Street, Wilburton, Cambs CB6 3RB, U.K.
Tel: 01353 740323
Computer Chess web pages+photos... http://www.elhchess.demon.co.uk


To give you a sense of what "SIMILAR but not exact result" means
I ran blundercheck in Fritz 7 with threshold set to 1 and the 'write
full variation' box not checked and then edited the output to deal
with symbols that are only in a Chess font and to put each half move
on a different line. This was the result

Ogush,Michael - NN
[Fritz 7]

1.e4= [0.22 Fritz 7: 1.d4= 0.06/12 ]
1...e5= [0.13 Fritz 7: 1...Nc6= 0.22/11 ]
2.Nf3= [0.25 Fritz 7: 2.d4= 0.13/10 ]
2...Nc6
3.Bc4 +/= [0.34 Fritz 7: 3.d4= 0.25/11 ]
3...Nf6
4.d4= [0.03 Fritz 7: 4.Ng5+ 0.31/10 ]
4...exd4
5.e5= [-0.19 Fritz 7: 5.Nbd2 =/+ -0.31/6 ]
5...Ng4
6.Bxf7+
6.... Kxf7
7.Ng5+
7...Ke8 +/= [0.59 Fritz 7: 7...Kg8 =/+ -0.31/5 ]
8.Qxg4
8....h6? [#3 Fritz 7: 8...Bb4+ +/- 0.91/4 ]
9.Qh5+
1-0

Some notes:
Fritz does not have an numeric evaluation for forced mate. It uses #n
to indicate mate in "approximately" n moves.

When one side makes a mistake the evaluation of the move played and
the best one are both given, e.g. Black's 7th move.

When the move played in the game was the best one sometimes Fritz will
give the evaluation of that move and the next best move (e.g. White's
5th move) , but not always (e.g. Black's 5th move). I don't know how
to force Fritz to do this all the time or even what criteria Fritz
uses to decide whether to do this or not.

When it does give a numeric evaluation of a move it also gives an
Informant symbolic evaluation (=, +/=, +/-, +-, etc.)

Hope this was helpful.

Mike Ogush
  #4  
Old July 25th 03, 01:07 AM
joe mccarron
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Program that provides numerical evals??

Thanks Mike I appreciate it. It sounds like blunder check with a 0 is what I want.

(Mike Ogush) wrote in message ...
On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 17:49:07 GMT,
(Mike Ogush)
wrote:

On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 14:14:09 +0100, Countrywide Computers
wrote:

In article , joe
mccarron writes
Hello
I wanted to know what if any programs analysis provides the numerical
eval of the move it suggests *and* the numerical value of the move
played in a game. I need a program that I can compare exactly how
much better the computer thinks its recomended move is than the one
played. Do any any programs provide both of the evaluations once it
is done analyzing?

I don't think fritz does this. After full analysis it gives at best
the informant style symbols for the lines it suggests and sometimes
for the lines played. I would like the *numbers* for all of its its
recomended moves and all of the moves played.

Anyone know if I can get this from Hiarcs Junior Tiger Rebel, cm or
any other program?

Thank you in advance for your help.
Joe

The Rebel programs did this in after-game analysis, but that is/was a
DOS program and no new versions have come out for a year or so making it
difficult to get hold of.

You get a SIMILAR but not exact result with Fritz, Junior & co if you
use BLUNDERCHECK and keep the Threshold figure pretty low to make sure
most/all moves get evaluated for any differences.

Eric
--
Eric Hallsworth for Countrywide Computers Ltd
Victoria House, 1 High Street, Wilburton, Cambs CB6 3RB, U.K.
Tel: 01353 740323
Computer Chess web pages+photos...
http://www.elhchess.demon.co.uk

To give you a sense of what "SIMILAR but not exact result" means
I ran blundercheck in Fritz 7 with threshold set to 1 and the 'write
full variation' box not checked and then edited the output to deal
with symbols that are only in a Chess font and to put each half move
on a different line. This was the result

Ogush,Michael - NN
[Fritz 7]

1.e4= [0.22 Fritz 7: 1.d4= 0.06/12 ]
1...e5= [0.13 Fritz 7: 1...Nc6= 0.22/11 ]
2.Nf3= [0.25 Fritz 7: 2.d4= 0.13/10 ]
2...Nc6
3.Bc4 +/= [0.34 Fritz 7: 3.d4= 0.25/11 ]
3...Nf6
4.d4= [0.03 Fritz 7: 4.Ng5+ 0.31/10 ]
4...exd4
5.e5= [-0.19 Fritz 7: 5.Nbd2 =/+ -0.31/6 ]
5...Ng4
6.Bxf7+
6.... Kxf7
7.Ng5+
7...Ke8 +/= [0.59 Fritz 7: 7...Kg8 =/+ -0.31/5 ]
8.Qxg4
8....h6? [#3 Fritz 7: 8...Bb4+ +/- 0.91/4 ]
9.Qh5+
1-0

Some notes:
Fritz does not have an numeric evaluation for forced mate. It uses #n
to indicate mate in "approximately" n moves.

When one side makes a mistake the evaluation of the move played and
the best one are both given, e.g. Black's 7th move.

When the move played in the game was the best one sometimes Fritz will
give the evaluation of that move and the next best move (e.g. White's
5th move) , but not always (e.g. Black's 5th move). I don't know how
to force Fritz to do this all the time or even what criteria Fritz
uses to decide whether to do this or not.

When it does give a numeric evaluation of a move it also gives an
Informant symbolic evaluation (=, +/=, +/-, +-, etc.)

Hope this was helpful.

Mike Ogush



Just after I sent the above message, I tried doing a Fritz
blundercheck with a threshold of 0 centi-pawns and I believe this will
do exactly what you want: It will display after each ply the
evaluation of the move palyed and the best move (or second best if the
move played was the best).along with its evaluation.

Mike Ogush

  #5  
Old July 25th 03, 01:09 AM
joe mccarron
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Program that provides numerical evals??

You didn't understand the question. I wanted it to be able to analyze
a game or group of games with a set time per move. I did not want to
sit there with infinite analysis on. But thank you for attempt at
being helpfull.

"Dr. Robert Faurisson" wrote in message .ca...
"joe mccarron" wrote in message
om...
Hello
I wanted to know what if any programs analysis provides the numerical
eval of the move it suggests *and* the numerical value of the move
played in a game. I need a program that I can compare exactly how
much better the computer thinks its recomended move is than the one
played.


Do the math moron! This is something a young child could figure out. You
enter the position one move before the move you want to analyze. You open
the required amount of lines in Fritz untill one of them is the move ..err
blunder in your case..... that was played, and you compare the evaluation
for that move with the evaluation for what Fritz considers the candidate
move. IN OTHER WORDS, YOU SUBTRACT. Is that simple enough for you to grasp?

snipped the rest of this idiots drivel [...bla bla bla...]

 




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