On Apr 15, 11:49 am, Mike Murray wrote:
On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Taylor:

The problem with your impassioned protest, Phil, is that the song in
question was in no way any local dialect, "Andean" or otherwise.

Phil:

** Did I ever say it was, Taylor? I rather thought you denied there was any
difference between Castillian, Mexican and Andean Spanish.

Taylor:

Ahem, Phil -- as is shown in the above link, you were not talking
about regional varieties of Spanish. You even denied that the lyric
was Spanish at all. You said: "It is not Spanish, it is Andean ..."

This never ceases to amaze me. Phil keeps making these gaffes and
boners, and then denies he committed 'em. He must know by now that
the first thing people will do is invoke Google and rub his nose in
his own words.

But Mike, as the "I'm not your boy!" incident shows, P Innes doesn't
recognize his own words.

For him, the old New Yorker cartoon caption, "On the Internet, nobody
knows your a dog.", morphs into, "On the Internet, everybody knows
you're a fraud."

wrote in message
...
On Apr 15, 10:07 am, "Chess One" wrote:
Kingston, try and think what you are arguing about. What is it?

I know exactly what I'm arguing,

**so state your point, and resist getting ****y! Let's see if you can do it
in what follows, since you may 'know' it, but you be unable to actually say
it


Phil. But as usual, you try to
shift ground, hoping by misdirection to deflect attention from your
own self-inflicted wounds.

** so far, no point...

It is YOUR guffaw which denied there even was an Andean Spanish, and
indeed
an Andean language! This surely would annoy those who speak it.

That is not at all the issue I raised, Phil, and you know it. At
issue was *_your_* claim that the song "Nazca" by Viva Quetzal was not
written in standard Spanish, when it plainly was. To claim that it is
'not Spanish but Andean'

**that is no quote! The /Spanish/ is Andean. And a native woman affirmed it.
You may not agree, but that is /your/ issue.

** you don't even understand what you are arguing with, you do not affirm if
you admit these different Spanish creoles exist. your 'point' goes like
this:

is like claiming the Beatles' "I Want to Hold
Your Hand" is not English, but Merseyan.

** as if I had said that, or it was some analogy - and on the basis of your
'interpretation' you then argue some point with me

Then two clowns Kennedy and the infamous linguist Brennan picked this up
and
paraded YOUR ignorance ever since, and you have not corrected them!

No, Phil, they just joined in the fun of watching you froth.

** Really? I thought they were here to ensure no one spoke about chess and
to stir the ****? And so Taylor Kingston continues to not- notice froth
makers, even if they utter disgusting remarks based on his own apprehensions
of some side issue from years ago. Not dissimilar to his fights with Evans
and Keene on chess.

So; if you have an issue, state it.

Already have, several times, Phil.

** ROFL! Can't do it! Kingston wants to stir the **** based on his
misunderstanding, so that at any time clowns who know no better can practice
their abuse? That is what he has written here

** And you are a nasty son of a bitch Kingston! You have said so 'several
times', but when asked what, you have nothing of substance to say - but are
very ready to rubbish people.

If not, don't analogize or change your point of view, or weave 'creative'
new threads to celebrate a few more reasons why you don't get on with
people
who know more than you do.

I don't want to play about with your strawmen

No straw, Phil, but your own gaffe, greatly compounded by your
committing more gaffes in trying to cover up your initial gaffe.

- just state whatever you think about the existence of Andean languages
or Andean Spanish -

Wow, talk about straw men.

** Look! you refuse to answer a straight question about what you think -
caling that 'straw men'. pfft!


That clear to you. Is that as clear as day?

It's quite clear that you are a stiff-necked fool who has publicly
painted himself into a corner in an utterly ludicrous fashion. It
continually amazes me that you think this does you any good,

** maybe I don't want to appear pretty for all the other boys here,
Kingston. You have just blathered yet again - avoided any substance while
POSING that you are not only right, but have the right to rubbish others.


that you
think you can somehow wish away your own statements that are indelibly
recorded here on rgc. The only effect is to make yourself the butt of
running jokes over and over again.

If not you are called again, so come on, out with it!

** Nothing of substance was revealed by Vaguer Kingston in this message,
except his attitude, and how concerned he is to preserve it, at practially
anyone's expense. What's new with that?

Phil Innes



Phil Innes

wrote in message

...

Ah, Phil, you never learn, do you? Your "Andean" gaffe was only
about a year and a half ago, yet you expect us all to have forgotten
it, so that you can get away with rewriting the facts? Sorry, bro,
won't fly. Interested readers can consult this September 2006 thread:

http://tinyurl.com/5pcahr

which presents the facts accurately.

On Apr 15, 8:14 am, "Chess One" wrote:

wrote in message

...
On Apr 14, 7:49 pm, "Chess One" wrote:

Hey Eyeore! Andeans speak Andean Spanish, as well as their navite
tongues.

"Navite"?

** Taylor - stop it! I put that in for Neil, because he loves that kind
of
stuff.

Ah yes, the old "I meant to do that!" ploy. Riiight.

I told you before to let him find stuff himself, cuz he cant write
about chess.

You wouldn't actually want to deny that like a bigot, would you? who
you think you are, Cortez?

Mexicans speak Mexican Spanish, not Castillian. Get it? I mean, do you
get
it?

I am very much aware of regional variations in Spanish. However,
that has no bearing on the "Nazca" song lyrics.

The problem with your impassioned protest, Phil, is that the song in
question was in no way any local dialect, "Andean" or otherwise.

** Did I ever say it was, Taylor? I rather thought you denied there was
any
difference between Castillian, Mexican and Andean Spanish.

Ahem, Phil -- as is shown in the above link, you were not talking
about regional varieties of Spanish. You even denied that the lyric
was Spanish at all. You said: "It is not Spanish, it is Andean ..."

I rather thought you denied there was any
difference between Castillian, Mexican and Andean Spanish.

I have never said that. Fabricating again, Phil?

I am sure your
opinions are fascinating, but a Californian friend of mine happens to be
a
Spanish speaker, and she is also a native American! and she also happend
to
have a PhD in English!

** SHE saw the differences in Mexican Spanish, from the high Andean
Creole
[if you understand that term properly, if you do not there is an
interesting
book, ******* Languages, which I suggest you consult before challenging
yet
another term]. I am so sorry you personally couldn't tell any difference
Taylor.

Did you consult this lady on the actual song in question? Did she
actually say it was "not Spanish, but Andean"? I rather think the
answer is "no" to both questions.



** But this is the danger, of taking on expert opinion such as Evans on
chess, and this S. American gal on Andean Spanish. Of course, I can't
prove
anything to you about Andean Spanish anymore than Evans can about high
level
GM chess, for the same reason. You already know everything.

It
was straight, standard Spanish, equally comprehensible to a Mexican,
Peruvian, Chilean, Venezuelan, Argentinian, Galician, or Castillian.

** While it may be 'understandable' that don't mean it is the same! And
I
think you rather lost track of what I said about the song - to get off
on
your 'knowledge' of Spanish. And so you have to invent my opinion for
me,
in
order to rubbish it. I simply mentioned the existence of Andean Spanish,
much as Patrick O'Brian mentions it in Wine Dark Sea, set 200 years ago,
and
you seem to argue about its very existence - but I see you have now
CHANGED
your opinion on that to if it is 'comprehensible'. )

** I'm sorry if I misunderstood you, your point being occluded by your
words.

Phil Innes

----------

As comprehensible to any of them as BBC Standard is to a native
English speaker of London, Liverpool, Johannesburg, San Francisco,
Boston or Austin. You tried to demonstrate faux erudition by claiming
a misspelling ("encerran" instead of "encierran") was a regional
dialect, when it was simply a typographical error.

*_YOUR OWN_* typographical error, in fact.

Interested readers who, unlike Phil, can actually understand
Spanish, can verify that the song is in standard Spanish by listening
to the song ("Nazca," from the Viva Quetzal album "Mujeres de la
Puna") he

http://tinyurl.com/oj48k

If need be I will post a scan of the actual album's lyric sheet on
Photobucket. com, and track down Phil's mistaken posts for
comparison.
Why not spare us the trouble, Phil? You wouldn't want to deny your
own mistake like a bigot, would you? Who do you think you are, Cortez?
The Pope? President Bush?

"The Historian" wrote in message

...

On Apr 14, 9:16 am, wrote:
On Apr 14, 9:13 am, Larry Tapper wrote:

On Apr 13, 12:46 pm, wrote:

On Apr 11, 11:50 am, wrote:
On Apr 10, 8:44 pm, wrote:
So, when Raymond Keene, followed sycophantically by Innes and
Parr,
tried to disparage my analytical skills, I was not concerned.
That
one
might miss something in Duras-Teichmann is not at all
surprising,
when
one has not analyzed the game at all. In contrast, Keene put
Anderssen-
Kieseritzky at the head of his 12 greatest games of all time,
as
unwilling or unconcerned to detect its flaws as Hellen Keller
was
to
distinguish Beethoven from Bullwinkle.

Was ist das, Verehrerpost von einer Flunder?

Eeny meeny, chili beany, die Geisten werden jetzt sprechen!

Is that Andean?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Phil, you're doing your usual clumsy evasions, a song-and-dance in
cement overshoes. Interested readers can find your original "Andean"
gaffe, from 30 August 2006, he

http://tinyurl.com/6n2pkk

and the group's reaction to it he

http://tinyurl.com/5pcahr

I guess when I get time I will have to scan the Viva Quetzal lyrics
to Photobucket, and post them, along with your absurd comments from
2006, in another thread here, to show yet again just how ludicrous
your Andean gaffe and subsequent frothings were. Mike Murray, Neil
Innes, David Kane, Dr. Dowd, Dr. Blair, Rev. Walker, Help-bot and
others who enjoy watching your pretensions get skewered will find it
highly amusing, I am sure.

On Apr 16, 8:35*am, "Chess One" wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Apr 15, 10:07 am, "Chess One" wrote:

Kingston, try and think what you are arguing about. What is it?

* I know exactly what I'm arguing,

**so state your point, and resist getting ****y! Let's see if you can do it
in what follows, since you may 'know' it, but you be unable to actually say
it

*Phil. But as usual, you try to
shift ground, hoping by misdirection to deflect attention from your
own self-inflicted wounds.

** so far, no point...

It is YOUR guffaw which denied there even was an Andean Spanish, and
indeed
an Andean language! This surely would annoy those who speak it.

* That is not at all the issue I raised, Phil, and you know it. At
issue was *_your_* claim that the song "Nazca" by Viva Quetzal was not
written in standard Spanish, when it plainly was. To claim that it is
'not Spanish but Andean'

**that is no quote! The /Spanish/ is Andean. And a native woman affirmed it.

On Apr 16, 9:51 am, wrote:
Phil, you're doing your usual clumsy evasions, a song-and-dance in
cement overshoes. Interested readers can find your original "Andean"
gaffe, from 30 August 2006, he

http://tinyurl.com/6n2pkk

and the group's reaction to it he

http://tinyurl.com/5pcahr

I guess when I get time I will have to scan the Viva Quetzal lyrics
to Photobucket, and post them, along with your absurd comments from
2006, in another thread here, to show yet again just how ludicrous
your Andean gaffe and subsequent frothings were. Mike Murray, Neil
Innes, David Kane, Dr. Dowd, Dr. Blair, Rev. Walker, Help-bot and
others who enjoy watching your pretensions get skewered will find it
highly amusing, I am sure.

Remind me to ask Taylor Parr who Neil Innes is. :-)

Seriously, we should have a website to preserve some of P Innes' most
inane posts. We could open with the Nearly an IM 2450 nonsense, and
then move onto.... well, we could vote on favorites.

On Apr 16, 11:09*am, The Historian
wrote:
On Apr 16, 9:51 am, wrote:





* Phil, you're doing your usual clumsy evasions, a song-and-dance in
cement overshoes. Interested readers can find your original "Andean"
gaffe, from 30 August 2006, he

*http://tinyurl.com/6n2pkk

and the group's reaction to it he

* *http://tinyurl.com/5pcahr

* I guess when I get time I will have to scan the Viva Quetzal lyrics
to Photobucket, and post them, along with your absurd comments from
2006, in another thread here, to show yet again just how ludicrous
your Andean gaffe and subsequent frothings were. Mike Murray, Neil
Innes, David Kane, Dr. Dowd, Dr. Blair, Rev. Walker, Help-bot and
others who enjoy watching your pretensions get skewered will find it
highly amusing, I am sure.

Remind me to ask Taylor Parr who Neil Innes is. :-)

Oops, sorry Neil -- I meant Brennen, of course. We ran out of
straight coffee this morning, so I'm running on half-decaf. Also still
a bit jet-lagged after my week in California. Or maybe I was thinking
of Neil Innes, of Bonzo Dog Band/Monty Python and the Holy Grail/
Rutles fame.

Seriously, we should have a website to preserve some of P Innes' most
inane posts. We could open with the Nearly an IM 2450 nonsense, and
then move onto.... well, we could vote on favorites.

To me the Andean gaffe has to be one of his best, especially since
it all evolved from Phil's stiff-necked refusal to admit that he had
made a tiny typo, "encerran" instead of "encierran." Instead of
admitting such a trivial error, that he misread or mistyped lyrics in
Spanish, a language he did not understand, Phil made the ludicrous
claim that the lyrics actually were not Spanish. Rather like hitting
his thumb with a hammer, and then explaining that his thumb is
actually not a thumb.

VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
Path: g2news2.google.com!news4.google.com!
border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!
nx01.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!69.28.1 86.75.MISMATCH!
hwmnpeer01.lga!news.highwinds-media.com!cycny01.gnilink.net!
spamkiller2.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!trndny02.POSTE D!02fb8435!not-for-
mail
From: "Chess One"
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess.politics
References: .com
.com
.com
.com KvlIg.
263$6E5.74@trndny05
.com PRnIg.
650$wI5.160@trndny04
. com mhIIg.
2104$aQ4.468@trndny06
. com 3IZIg.
179$XK4.127@trndny07
.com 9U0Jg.
2348$ag4.1077@trndny09
. com Ba2Jg.
929$Xw6.827@trndny02
.com
Subject: The Innes Pledge - Revised and Updated
Lines: 77
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962
X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original
Message-ID: IwlJg.1832$Xw6.1329@trndny02
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:19:04 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.222.104.188
X-Complaints-To:
X-Trace: trndny02 1156965544 64.222.104.188 (Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:19:04
EDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:19:04 EDT


"Taylor Kingston" wrote in message
oups.com...
** this is so, evdiently you never had a girl friend from Andaluthia g

Andalusía, with fields full of grain / I long to see you again and
again.

***
where is paradise,
my shadow, you that were there?
a silent question

cities without answers
rivers without speech, peaks
without echoes, nute seas

no one knows...

--------
ay ay ay ay!
Take this broken-waisted waltz

said Lorca.


In that case, I would suggest that you miscopied the penultimate
line, and that it should read "¿Qué misterios los encierran?", which
would give it the meaning indicated by this translation. Your
rendering, "¿Qué misterios nos encerran?", has a word ("encerran")
that afaik does not exist in Spanish, and "nos" means "us" as opposed
to "los" meaning "them."

***
it is not Spanish, it is Andean as might be supposed from the title,
and is
what language they took to themselves for themselves, not to thee, and
not
to thy understanding

And I think this traditional song has what Lorca called, duende - though
/la
duende/ is little known, and has no English equivalent. All things good
indeed, come to an end, while evil endures.

Hard to square that POV with the general trend of history, which
does
seem to indicate overall if intermittent progress toward improvement.

***
it is always difficult to admit the value of what is known to what is
unknown
as if we really had a preference, even knowing that the unknown is
unknowable
are our values changed?

Or are you explaining your continued presence here on rgcp?!

***
its a show about
my neighbor in a loneliness, a light,
walking the hour when every bed is a mouth,
alleys of dark trash, exhaustion
shaped into residences -- and what are the dogs
so sure of that they shout like citizens
driven from their minds in a stadium?

in his fist he holds a note
in his own handwriting,
the same message everyone carries
from place to place in the secret night,
the one that nobody asks you for
when you finally arrive, and the faces
turn to you playing the national anthem
and go blank, that's
what the show is about, that message.

Phil
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 05:03:13 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Apr 4, 7:11=A0am, samsloan wrote:

Be on the lookout for my book about Warren G. Harding, the Greatest of
American Presidents,

Right, and Teapot Dome was the republic's shining moment, surpassing
in glory even such triumphs as Pearl Harbor and Watergate.

Sam, April 1st was last Tuesday.


The book just this minute finally came out.

$29.95 plus free shipping from Amazon, available at:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891234

464 pages

Although best known for its accounts of hot sex with the President in
the White House Laundry Room, a large part of the book is concerned
with efforts of the mother to obtain child support for her
illegitimate child, who was left destitute after the untimely death of
her father, who had been President of the United States.

Sam Sloan