At 05:41 AM 8/27/2003, wrote:
Ponomariov, the so-called FIDE World Champion, has once again refused
to sign a contract to play the match with Kasparov. The cry-baby of
chess clearly knows as does everybody else what the result of this
match will be and he does not want to lose his world championship.

Today is the final deadline. If Ponomariov does not sign, and it seems
likely that he will not, FIDE should declare that Ponomariov is no
longer world champion and should substitute Anand to play Kasparov
instead. Ponomariov has no credibility as world champion anyway.
Nobody believes that Ponomariov is the best player in the world and
there will be little interest in a match between him and Kasparov.
Anand on the other hand is a serious opponent and the world would be
very interested in a match between Anand and Kasparov.

http://www.worldchessrating.com/5309...34374822117388

Sam Sloan

There was a 48 hour extension agreed to. Kasparov's giving a press
conference on Russian TV today.

However, FIDE statutes are clear - Ivanchuk would be the replacement.
However, it's pretty clear everyone's going to make an effort to have this
match happen (except Ponomariov the whiny Ukranian brat). There's been no
talk about Anand, and it's pretty clear that there's no rationale to have
Anand in, even though it makes sense.

My understanding is Kasparov gave in to all of Ponomariov's demands, and
Ponomariov is still refusing to sign.

John Fernandez

On 27 Aug 2003 11:03:09 GMT, eepmeep (John
Fernandez) wrote:

There was a 48 hour extension agreed to. Kasparov's giving a press
conference on Russian TV today.

However, FIDE statutes are clear - Ivanchuk would be the replacement.
However, it's pretty clear everyone's going to make an effort to have this
match happen (except Ponomariov the whiny Ukranian brat). There's been no
talk about Anand, and it's pretty clear that there's no rationale to have
Anand in, even though it makes sense.

My understanding is Kasparov gave in to all of Ponomariov's demands, and
Ponomariov is still refusing to sign.

John Fernandez

Perhaps you can explain to us why Anand was excluded from the
competition. I know that he was not allowed to contest the World
Championship. I would like to find out why.

Anyway, Ivanchuk has lost so many times that it would be pointless to
put him into a match with Kasparov. Even if Ivanchuk won, that would
only prove that Kasparov has gotten weaker or was not playing well.

The only match with credibility would be Anand-Kasparov. Even Judit
Polgar vs. Kasparov would have more credibility than another Ivanchuk
match.

Sam Sloan

At 08:24 AM 8/27/2003, wrote:
Perhaps you can explain to us why Anand was excluded from the
competition. I know that he was not allowed to contest the World
Championship. I would like to find out why.

Someone had to play Ponomariov. In the absence of any other contender, they
used the #1 player on the rating list. (After all, a good tool to give the
rating list some value.)

And anyway, including Kasparov in the situation would be a sure-fire way to
ensure that funding would be forthcoming.

Call it choosing a reasonable system that is also what the marketplace wants.

As far as Anand, he's the World's #3, and got knocked out by Ivanchuk in
the Semis last time. He would certainly be included if the list was bigger
(or if Kasparov declined?!) Anand has repeatedly said he doesn't mind
skipping this one- his concern is future cycles.

Anyway, Ivanchuk has lost so many times that it would be pointless to
put him into a match with Kasparov. Even if Ivanchuk won, that would
only prove that Kasparov has gotten weaker or was not playing well.

Well, the problem with this is that we get a situation like in the early
20th century, where the challenger is whoever is marketable, not
necessarily the best player. Note- we already had a similar situation when
Kasparov - Shirov was trying to happen.

And after all, that's why they play the matches. Ivanchuk is the type who
could show up in incredible form- he could also really collapse. He's a
true wild card in this. Ivanchuk has completely creamed in-form Kasparovs
before.

The only match with credibility would be Anand-Kasparov. Even Judit
Polgar vs. Kasparov would have more credibility than another Ivanchuk
match.

Sam Sloan

Yeah but we're very picky about our lineage. Practically everyone I've
talked to is rooting for Kasparov-Ponomariov to happen and produce a
Ponomariov winner, and then Kramnik-Leko to happen and produce a Kramnik
winner. That way the past 10 years of splintered history can be put back
together. One thing you CAN'T do is just start randomly picking people.

Interesting note- if Ivanchuk cancels, would it next go to Svidler? Then Anand?

John Fernandez

Pono fits right in, doesn't he?

adp

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 09:42:16 GMT, (Sam Sloan)
wrote:

[snipped]

Just for the case that someone likes to have a less onesided view and
a view that at least makes a bit of sense in contrast to the - once
again - completely ridiculous statement of the original poster, who
supports his view with a statement from one of the involved sides
(ROTFL).

http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=1149

btw.: Who really doubts the accusations of Pono's manager knowing only
some details of the things that happened in the last months or years?
At least I don't.

Andreas

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 14:22:36 +0100, Andreas Walkenhorst
wrote:


http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=1149

btw.: Who really doubts the accusations of Pono's manager knowing only
some details of the things that happened in the last months or years?
At least I don't.

Andreas

What accusations? I do not see any.

It is clear that FIDE has the right to control its own World
Championship. Ponomariov on the other hand has been finishing last or
near the bottom of recent tournaments. In fact, Ponomariov has never
won a major grandmaster tournament in his entire life. He became the
FIDE World Champion essentially by luck.

FIDE has gone to exceptional lengths to accommodate Ponomariov. I do
not see how FIDE can go any further.

Sam Sloan

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 13:48:29 GMT, EZoto wrote:


http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=1149

In my opinion it looks to me that Pono is just afraid of Kasparov. It
doesn't look like the issue is money so why the fuss? In my opinion
just ignore Pono and if Kasparov was a real man then play the match
you should have played. Play Shirov and the winner plays the winner
of Kramnik - Leko. There. Everythings settled.

Let me just ask some questions:

- If the winner of the final of the reunifiction match will be the new
champ (which IMO makes the Kasparov vs Pono match per definition a
semi final) why does FIDE insist on the position that the winner of
the match K vs P will be FIDE champ? Who profits from that position???

- If this *is* a Championship match (which FIDE claims), why does Pono
does not get the usual advantage of the champ (if the match is drawn
the old champ holds his title. In fact originally FIDE tried to settle
the contract the other way round: In case of a draw the challenger
(!!!!) should get the title)? Who profits from that position???

Concerning your argumentation: Why the heck should Pono fear Kasparov?
If he'd loose, the chess world will say that this was just normal.
If he'd win he will not only prove that he is a world class player,
but also would completely demolish Kasparovs reputation.
He has nothing to fear and nothing to loose, as he has time for other
shots at the chamionship, Kasparov probably not.

Ignore Pono? He is the champ. Even FIDE may be unable to ignore its
own champ. IMO ignoring Kasparov would be correct, as he did nothing
to qualify for this match. He refused to play Dortmund, though before
the K vs K match in London he signed a conrtract that he had to play
that tourney if he looses the match.

But as FIDE (not Pono!) seems to do anything to not let the match
happen (who profits from that???), I guess Kasparov will be champ
without a single move.

Now taking in account the most important motto "cui bono", "who
profits", IMO we have a hint who *really* fears that match.

Andreas

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 13:45:48 GMT, (Sam Sloan)
wrote:

[snip]

What accusations? I do not see any.

maybe you should read everything at the link.

It is clear that FIDE has the right to control its own World
Championship. Ponomariov on the other hand has been finishing last or
near the bottom of recent tournaments. In fact, Ponomariov has never
won a major grandmaster tournament in his entire life. He became the
FIDE World Champion essentially by luck.

Sorry, but this argumentation is nonsense. Pono is champ. Full stop.
And if you tell me that it was luck that he got champ (which is
completely irrelevant btw), I guess you should play over his games.
If you tell me that he did not win world class tourneys (which is
completely irrelevant btw), I may remind you that he just did not play
*many* of them. and - at least - in Dos Hermanos, FIDE officials
insisted to talk to him about the match *during* (!!) his games.
Really good for the concentration I guess.

FIDE has gone to exceptional lengths to accommodate Ponomariov. I do
not see how FIDE can go any further.

Accomodate Pono? When the only thing that FIDE does is share Kasparovs
positions? This is just ridiculous.

Andreas

"B. G." wrote in message
om...
...and by defaulting Ponomariov, FIDE is left without a sponsor, going
backwards... there maybe a sponsor in the wings for a potential
Anand-Kasparov, but that would also take time... in any case, why
choose Anand over say, Ivanchuk?

No, Anand lost to Ivanchuk during the last FIDE WCC so Chucky has more
rights to play the match than Vishy.
Without sponsors are left apparently Kaspy and Kramnik so they are back to
dear mom&dad ;-)


Regards,
Jerzy

In article ,
says...
On 27 Aug 2003 11:03:09 GMT, eepmeep (John
Fernandez) wrote:

There was a 48 hour extension agreed to. Kasparov's giving a press
conference on Russian TV today.

However, FIDE statutes are clear - Ivanchuk would be the replacement.
However, it's pretty clear everyone's going to make an effort to have this
match happen (except Ponomariov the whiny Ukranian brat). There's been no
talk about Anand, and it's pretty clear that there's no rationale to have
Anand in, even though it makes sense.

My understanding is Kasparov gave in to all of Ponomariov's demands, and
Ponomariov is still refusing to sign.

John Fernandez

Perhaps you can explain to us why Anand was excluded from the
competition. I know that he was not allowed to contest the World
Championship. I would like to find out why.

Anyway, Ivanchuk has lost so many times that it would be pointless to
put him into a match with Kasparov. Even if Ivanchuk won, that would
only prove that Kasparov has gotten weaker or was not playing well.

The only match with credibility would be Anand-Kasparov. Even Judit
Polgar vs. Kasparov would have more credibility than another Ivanchuk
match.

Sam Sloan


I agree with you here. I believe Judit Polgar would make a better choice
for an opponent for Kasparov than Ivanchuk (even though Chucky beat
Kaspy twice). The reasoning is simple...For Ivanchuk to suddenly be
thrust upon the stage at this point to be the main challenger for
Kasparov would look comical if not downright hilarious. He would need
months of preparatory training before such a match with Kasparov to take
place. On the other hand, Judit Polgar is on a mean streak right now and
she's primed and raring to go at with Kasparov. She has momentum on her
side, notwithstanding two grueling rapid matches with Boris Gefland and
Vishy Anand. (She lost both). But she has a score to settile with
Kasparov - the controversial take back knight move by Kasparov at
Linares 94 still rankles in her mind. Judit Polgar has beaten them all
except for Kramnik. Now THAT'S the match I want to see. Kramnik vs
Polgar for the title. Now that match would be brutal. Kramnik is the new
Karpov and like it or not Judit Polgar is the new Fischer/Kasparov.

But before we get there, there has to be some semblence of order and
fairness. Ivanchuk and Anand have to be invited. I would have a slugfest
between Shirov, Radjabov, Anand, Ivanchuk Polgar and let's throw in
Bologan! Bologan did better than Leko at the recent Dortmund tournament.
I would have Judit Polgar vs. Bologan, Ivanchuk vs Shirov, Radjubov vs
Anand and the one who wins sho has the higher rating gets a bye while
the other survivors battle it out to face the winner. For example, if
Anand were to beat Radjabov, he would get the bye for the next round
since he's automatically entitled to a rest day by virtue of his FIDE
rating. So, Anand would survive to watch Judit Polgar battle it out with
Ivanchuk or Shirov. Of course this assumes Judit Polgar can beat Bologan
and there's no sure bet that she could. Theoretically Bologan could be
the real threat to win it all. He did come ahead of Kramnik so that
should be something worth noting.

But a match between Gary kasparov and Judit Polgar would generate
tremendous press and coverage. So I'd think it would be in FIDE's best
interest to get as much publicity as it can out of a chess championship
match. The best way to do this is to give the spot to Judit Polgar if
Ponomariov refuses to sign the dotted line.