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Old March 11th 10, 03:39 PM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
I have a registered copyright on more than 50 books
with the US Copyright office, you can look it up, and I speak to the
copyright office all the time, so it is a safe bet that I know
something about copyright law.

Sam Sloan

Talking doesn't do any good if you don't know enough to ask the right
questions.

One crude example of your lack of knowledge: In the course of your
various spitting matches on rgcp, you cited the "Orphan Copyright
Act," which would allow the reprint of works if a "reasonable effort"
failed to turn up the copyright holder. Many people think this would
be a good idea. I do myself. It is not, however, the law, having died
in committee each time it was introduced. If you can't get something
as simple as that right, how can you expect ever to be taken seriously?
I just looked it up to see if John Hillery has a copyright on any book
and I found that he has none.

The "Orphan Copyright Act" was concerned with the case of an author
who is alive but cannot be located perhaps because he moved and left
no forwarding address.

Most of the cases we are concerned with here are where the author died
without heirs more than sixty years ago and there is no copyright
claimant. Those works are public domain.

I am not interested in debating with John Hillery because he knows
nothing of this subject.

Sam Sloan

We can only thank Sam for demonstrating --- yet again -- the full
extent of his qualifications to serve on the Executive Board. Breadth
of knowledge, good judgement, grasp of his own limitations.

After all, zero is also a number.

(BTW, when exactly was it that Arpad Elo died? Perhaps my memory is at
fault, but I don't think it was 60 years ago.)

John Hillery
When Arpad Elo, who died without heirs, is looking down from the sky
or up from HELL as the case may be, to you think he is happy that I
reprinted his book "The Rating of Chess Players, Past and Present"
0-923891-27-7, thereby making his book that was almost impossible to
obtain as a used book, readily available to the public, or is he
happy?

Note: The Moderators on the USCF Issues Forum have prohibited me from
mentioning my books there, claiming that it is "advertising", but
since John Hillery has brought it up, I feel that I should be allowed
to respond.

Sam Sloan

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891277

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo...SBN=0923891277
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Old March 11th 10, 09:50 PM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

[quote="David Ames"]
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
It is 100% certain that "My
System" is in public domain.

There are several reasons for this. The most obvious is that it was
first published in Germany. Any book published in Germany before 1945
is public domain because we were at war with Nazi Germany.

However, a translator might have a claim if he would assert it.[/
quote]

There is something to your claim regarding pre-1945 German copyright.
However, I am not certain that you have got it right. Do you claim
that Courant's Differential and Integral Calculus (a pre-WWII German
book) is in the public domain; and, if so, on what grounds? And the
copyright to the British- and American-published editions?

My memory is foggy on this, but I believe that the changed nature of
copyright on books on German origin was a matter of war reparations,
and that American publishers (such as Chelsea, which published -- or
publishes -- math books) were excused from paying royalties owed on
account of their already-existing translations into English. But I am
not convinced that your blanket assertion is correct.
Here is an example about Dover Publications: "The company published
its first book, Tables of Functions with Formulas and Curves, when the
German copyright was voided by the United States as a result of World
War II."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dover_Publications
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Old March 11th 10, 11:57 PM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,146
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

The book by Arpad Elo was perhaps something of note in its day but
that
day has long passed. Now a reader might well be struck at how out of
date
it seems. Rather than just reprint old works why don't you attempt
to write
something of your own? Take an old idea and make it new, 'up to the
minute' current and therefore better than any reheated 'nine days old'
peas
porridge.

Here's an idea for you to consider: with your many inside contacts
at the
USCF you could perhaps acquire data on how USCF ratings and the pool
itself has changed over the course of these last few decades. Why
are so
many people sitting on their rating floors? And what was the overall
effect
of the sudden abandonment of the USCF's bonus and feedback system
which had apparently driven ratings skyward?

Another idea would be to take some of the better ancient texts
which
contain game analysis and 'score' the famous players as to how well
they
each did, now that we have chess computers which 'see everything'. I
am
especially interested in whether there is a correlation between
obnoxious
arrogance (think Taylor Kingston) and poor analysis as I suspect
there
may well be, or if instead it is the good natured dimwits (think
Sanny) who
come out worse in this regard (assuming there is any correlation at
all).

Here's another idea: you could write a book of pure fiction focusing
on
your many 'accomplishments' within the USCF, your world travels
(think
Marco Polo) or even your chess games. Take my word for it: many of
those dusty old chess books were not all that good, so why not do the
world a favor and NOT reprint them just to make a few bucks. Come up
wih something new and original, like me. Your friend, Will
Shakespeare



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Old March 12th 10, 12:12 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Posts: 319
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

On Mar 11, 7:39*am, samsloan wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
I have a registered copyright on more than 50 books
with the US Copyright office, you can look it up, and I speak to the
copyright office all the time, so it is a safe bet that I know
something about copyright law.

Sam Sloan

Talking doesn't do any good if you don't know enough to ask the right
questions.

One crude example of your lack of knowledge: In the course of your
various spitting matches on rgcp, you cited the "Orphan Copyright
Act," which would allow the reprint of works if a "reasonable effort"
failed to turn up the copyright holder. Many people think this would
be a good idea. I do myself. It is not, however, the law, having died
in committee each time it was introduced. If you can't get something
as simple as that right, how can you expect ever to be taken seriously?

I just looked it up to see if John Hillery has a copyright on any book
and I found that he has none.

The "Orphan Copyright Act" was concerned with the case of an author
who is alive but cannot be located perhaps because he moved and left
no forwarding address.

Most of the cases we are concerned with here are where the author died
without heirs more than sixty years ago and there is no copyright
claimant. Those works are public domain.

I am not interested in debating with John Hillery because he knows
nothing of this subject.

Sam Sloan

We can only thank Sam for demonstrating --- yet again -- the full
extent of his qualifications to serve on the Executive Board. Breadth
of knowledge, good judgement, grasp of his own limitations.

After all, zero is also a number.

(BTW, when exactly was it that Arpad Elo died? Perhaps my memory is at
fault, but I don't think it was 60 years ago.)

John Hillery *

When Arpad Elo, who died without heirs, is looking down from the sky
or up from HELL as the case may be, to you think he is happy that I
reprinted his book "The Rating of Chess Players, Past and Present"
0-923891-27-7, thereby making his book that was almost impossible to
obtain as a used book, readily available to the public, or is he
happy?

Note: The Moderators on the USCF Issues Forum have prohibited me from
mentioning my books there, claiming that it is "advertising", but
since John Hillery has brought it up, I feel that I should be allowed
to respond.

Sam Sloan

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891277

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo....asp?ISBN=0923....



Did I really? Or did you just imagine it, as is your habit? You made
several positive assertions on that thread. I showed that they were
either clearly false, or so unlikely as to required hard evidence,
which, of course, you were unable to provide. Your problem, Sam, is
not with me for showing you to be a blithering booby. It's with
yourself for being one.

As for Elo: The book was copyrighted. Unless the copyright holder
voluntarily put it in public domain at some point, it is still under
copyright. If you think the work is no longer under copyright, the
burden is on you to demonstrate it, with facts and not delusio0nal
legal theories. Of course, as has been pointed out on the USCF Forum,
only the copyright holder has legal standing to challenge your piracy,
and since a) the book is not likely to make much money and b) you have
nothing to collect, it is likely you will get way with it. It matters
only because it demonstrates to the USCF members your contempt for the
law, property rights, and everything except your own wretched little
ego. But, then, we already knew you were scum. Thanks for the
reminder.


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Old March 12th 10, 12:36 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Posts: 14,870
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

On Mar 11, 7:12*pm, jkh001 wrote:
On Mar 11, 7:39*am, samsloan wrote:



Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
I have a registered copyright on more than 50 books
with the US Copyright office, you can look it up, and I speak to the
copyright office all the time, so it is a safe bet that I know
something about copyright law.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan

Sam Sloan


Talking doesn't do any good if you don't know enough to ask the right
questions.


One crude example of your lack of knowledge: In the course of your
various spitting matches on rgcp, you cited the "Orphan Copyright
Act," which would allow the reprint of works if a "reasonable effort"
failed to turn up the copyright holder. Many people think this would
be a good idea. I do myself. It is not, however, the law, having died
in committee each time it was introduced. If you can't get something
as simple as that right, how can you expect ever to be taken seriously?


I just looked it up to see if John Hillery has a copyright on any book
and I found that he has none.


The "Orphan Copyright Act" was concerned with the case of an author
who is alive but cannot be located perhaps because he moved and left
no forwarding address.


Most of the cases we are concerned with here are where the author died
without heirs more than sixty years ago and there is no copyright
claimant. Those works are public domain.


I am not interested in debating with John Hillery because he knows
nothing of this subject.


Sam Sloan


We can only thank Sam for demonstrating --- yet again -- the full
extent of his qualifications to serve on the Executive Board. Breadth
of knowledge, good judgement, grasp of his own limitations.


After all, zero is also a number.


(BTW, when exactly was it that Arpad Elo died? Perhaps my memory is at
fault, but I don't think it was 60 years ago.)


John Hillery *


When Arpad Elo, who died without heirs, is looking down from the sky
or up from HELL as the case may be, to you think he is happy that I
reprinted his book "The Rating of Chess Players, Past and Present"
0-923891-27-7, thereby making his book that was almost impossible to
obtain as a used book, readily available to the public, or is he
happy?


Note: The Moderators on the USCF Issues Forum have prohibited me from
mentioning my books there, claiming that it is "advertising", but
since John Hillery has brought it up, I feel that I should be allowed
to respond.


Sam Sloan


http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891277


http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo....asp?ISBN=0923....


Did I really? Or did you just imagine it, as is your habit? You made
several positive assertions on that thread. I showed that they were
either clearly false, or so unlikely as to required hard evidence,
which, of course, you were unable to provide. Your problem, Sam, is
not with me for showing you to be a blithering booby. It's with
yourself for being one.

As for Elo: The book was copyrighted. Unless the copyright holder
voluntarily put it in public domain at some point, it is still under
copyright. If you think the work is no longer under copyright, the
burden is on you to demonstrate it, with facts and not delusio0nal
legal theories. Of course, as has been pointed out on the USCF Forum,
only the copyright holder has legal standing to challenge your piracy,
and since a) the book is not likely to make much money and b) you have
nothing to collect, it is likely you will get way with it. It matters
only because it demonstrates to the USCF members your contempt for the
law, property rights, and everything except your own wretched little
ego. But, then, we already knew you were scum. Thanks for the
reminder.


Would you mind telling us who the copyright holder is?

Sam Sloan


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Old March 12th 10, 12:40 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Posts: 14,870
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

On Mar 11, 6:57*pm, The Master wrote:

(think Marco Polo)


Actually, I am working on a Marco Polo book and have already spent
money on it.

However, I cannot find the book I want.

The book I want is Marco Polo Description of the World by A. C. Moule
and Paul Pelliot published in 1938 by Rutledge & Co. in London.

Do you know where I can pick it up?

Sam Sloan
  #7   Report Post  
Old March 12th 10, 01:03 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Oct 2004
Posts: 668
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

samsloan wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeditor
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
I have a registered copyright on more than 50 books
with the US Copyright office, you can look it up, and I speak to the
copyright office all the time, so it is a safe bet that I know
something about copyright law.

Sam Sloan


Talking doesn't do any good if you don't know enough to ask the right
questions.

One crude example of your lack of knowledge: In the course of your
various spitting matches on rgcp, you cited the "Orphan Copyright
Act," which would allow the reprint of works if a "reasonable effort"
failed to turn up the copyright holder. Many people think this would
be a good idea. I do myself. It is not, however, the law, having died
in committee each time it was introduced. If you can't get something
as simple as that right, how can you expect ever to be taken
seriously?

I just looked it up to see if John Hillery has a copyright on any book
and I found that he has none.

The "Orphan Copyright Act" was concerned with the case of an author
who is alive but cannot be located perhaps because he moved and left
no forwarding address.

Most of the cases we are concerned with here are where the author died
without heirs more than sixty years ago and there is no copyright
claimant. Those works are public domain.

I am not interested in debating with John Hillery because he knows
nothing of this subject.

Sam Sloan


We can only thank Sam for demonstrating --- yet again -- the full
extent of his qualifications to serve on the Executive Board. Breadth
of knowledge, good judgement, grasp of his own limitations.

After all, zero is also a number.

(BTW, when exactly was it that Arpad Elo died? Perhaps my memory is at
fault, but I don't think it was 60 years ago.)

John Hillery

When Arpad Elo, who died without heirs,


A version of this obituary & biography appeared in print on November 14,
1992, on page 127 of the New York edition:

Professor Elo's wife, Henriette, died three years ago. He is survived by his
son, Arpad E. Jr. of St. Johnsbury, Vt., and a sister, Bertha Papp of
Alrington Heights, Ill.

Photo: Prof. Arpad E. Elo (Allen Y. Scott/Milwaukee Sentinel, 1980)



is looking down from the sky
or up from HELL as the case may be, to you think he is happy that I
reprinted his book "The Rating of Chess Players, Past and Present"
0-923891-27-7, thereby making his book that was almost impossible to
obtain as a used book, readily available to the public, or is he
happy?

Note: The Moderators on the USCF Issues Forum have prohibited me from
mentioning my books there, claiming that it is "advertising", but
since John Hillery has brought it up, I feel that I should be allowed
to respond.

Sam Sloan

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0923891277

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo...SBN=0923891277


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Old March 12th 10, 01:23 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Oct 2004
Posts: 668
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

samsloan wrote:
[quote="David Ames"]
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan
It is 100% certain that "My
System" is in public domain.

There are several reasons for this. The most obvious is that it was
first published in Germany. Any book published in Germany before 1945
is public domain because we were at war with Nazi Germany.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsloan

Nonsense. Enemy property was controlled, managed and accounted for by
the Alien Property Custodian. Patents and Copyrights did not become
public property. An example of a Chelsea book published 1948 - Salomon
Bochner,
Vorlesungen über Fouriersche Integrale - bears the imprint:

Copyright 1932 by Akademische Verlagsgesellschaft M.B.H., Leipzig.
Copyright vested in the Attorney General pursuant to law.
Published and Distributed in the Public Interest by Authority
of the Attorney General under License No. A-1303

A side-effect of this policy was that emigrants who fled Germany were
dispossessed. The injustice of this was particularly striking in the
case of people like Bochner, a Jew who fled in 1933.



However, a translator might have a claim if he would assert it.[/
quote]

There is something to your claim regarding pre-1945 German copyright.
However, I am not certain that you have got it right. Do you claim
that Courant's Differential and Integral Calculus (a pre-WWII German
book) is in the public domain; and, if so, on what grounds? And the
copyright to the British- and American-published editions?

My memory is foggy on this, but I believe that the changed nature of
copyright on books on German origin was a matter of war reparations,
and that American publishers (such as Chelsea, which published -- or
publishes -- math books) were excused from paying royalties owed on
account of their already-existing translations into English. But I am
not convinced that your blanket assertion is correct.


Here is an example about Dover Publications: "The company published
its first book, Tables of Functions with Formulas and Curves, when the
German copyright was voided by the United States as a result of World
War II."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dover_Publications


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Old March 12th 10, 01:37 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Posts: 1,146
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

On Mar 11, 7:40*pm, samsloan wrote:

Actually, I am working on a Marco Polo book and have already spent
money on it.

However, I cannot find the book I want.

The book I want is Marco Polo Description of the World by A. C. Moule
and Paul Pelliot published in 1938 by Rutledge & Co. in London.

Do you know where I can pick it up?



Sorry, I wasn't in London in 1938. Regretfully, at that time I was
playing
hard to get-- convinced that isolationism was the best path and that
the
idiotic warmongering of European nations was something I wanted no
part
in. (Only later did I discover how much FUN war could be.)

When Marco Polo returned to Europe and reported what he had seen,
he
was generally regarded as a liar. His book was often referred to as
'the
millions', as in the millions of lies it supposedly contained. Don't
take that
as a challenge, Sam. Lying is not a contest.
  #10   Report Post  
Old March 12th 10, 03:12 AM posted to rec.games.chess.politics,misc.legal,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 14,870
Default Hillery objects to Sloan Reprint of Elo Ratings Book

On Mar 11, 8:37*pm, The Master wrote:
On Mar 11, 7:40*pm, samsloan wrote:

Actually, I am working on a Marco Polo book and have already spent
money on it.


However, I cannot find the book I want.


The book I want is Marco Polo Description of the World by A. C. Moule
and Paul Pelliot published in 1938 by Rutledge & Co. in London.


Do you know where I can pick it up?


* Sorry, I wasn't in London in 1938. * Regretfully, at that time I was
playing
hard to get-- convinced that isolationism was the best path and that
the
idiotic warmongering of European nations was something I wanted no
part
in. * (Only later did I discover how much FUN war could be.)

* When Marco Polo returned to Europe and reported what he had seen,
he was generally regarded as a liar. * His book was often referred to as
'the millions', as in the millions of lies it supposedly contained. *Don't
take that as a challenge, Sam. *Lying is not a contest.


This has not been absolutely decided. I have personally been to almost
every place Marco Polo said he was and his descriptions are so
accurate it seems that he must have been there. On the other hand some
places are not identifiable. For example, he describes the Island of
Madagascar, an island that was not known to Europe until 300 years
later. He describes something very similar to the Forbidden City in
Beijing but the one we know today was not built until 400 years later.
He seems to be describing Nuristan in Afghanistan. He describes the
Yaks one encounters when crossing the Pamirs from Afghanistan to
China.

However, it is possible that other travelers told him about these
places and then he made some stuff up. More research needs to be done
on this.

Sam Sloan
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