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Old April 9th 04, 09:26 AM
Rik
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play agressive
and sharp lines?

Rik


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Old April 9th 04, 10:57 AM
Avanti
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?


"Rik" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play

agressive
and sharp lines?


....e5 or c5


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Old April 9th 04, 02:51 PM
SaltOfLife
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

"Rik" wrote in message news:[email protected]
What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play agressive
and sharp lines?

Rik


I can see 1...c5, 1...e5, or 1...d5 followed by 2...Nf6
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Old April 9th 04, 04:56 PM
Avanti
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?


"SaltOfLife" wrote in message
m...
"Rik" wrote in message

news:[email protected]
What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play

agressive
and sharp lines?

Rik


I can see 1...c5, 1...e5, or 1...d5 followed by 2...Nf6


I forgot about centre counter or scandanavian only because after e4 d5 I
play e5 transposing into an advanced caro kann or french which then is not
so sharp immediately.


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Old April 10th 04, 12:22 AM
Ron
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

In article ,
"Avanti" wrote:


I forgot about centre counter or scandanavian only because after e4 d5 I
play e5 transposing into an advanced caro kann or french which then is not
so sharp immediately.


It doesn't transpose into either a caro-kann or french. Black gets the
best of both:

He can play his "bad" french bishop to f5 or g4 before playing -e6, and
the c-pawn is going to get to c5 in one move rather than two. If white
responded to the scandinavian with 2.e5 with any regularity, it would be
a much more popular opening.

The French can, too, be very sharp, but white has to co-operate-- eg if
he plays the exchange, well, it's not going to be super-sharp, now, is
it. But the Winawer poisoned pawn? They don't get much sharper. But in
most lines, white has a choice which will take all the "fun" out of the
opening:

the c3 sicilian, the four knights, etc etc etc.


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Old April 10th 04, 12:45 AM
Avanti
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?


"Ron" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Avanti" wrote:


I forgot about centre counter or scandanavian only because after e4 d5 I
play e5 transposing into an advanced caro kann or french which then is

not
so sharp immediately.


It doesn't transpose into either a caro-kann or french. Black gets the
best of both:

He can play his "bad" french bishop to f5


Then I play g4 and chase the bishop which loses lots of tempi before it gets
exchanged.

or g4 before playing -e6, and
the c-pawn is going to get to c5 in one move rather than two. If white
responded to the scandinavian with 2.e5 with any regularity, it would be
a much more popular opening.


I cannot argue as i am only a novice, it is just a line i play with success.


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Old April 10th 04, 02:04 AM
Mike Ogush
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

On Fri, 09 Apr 2004 16:22:09 -0700, Ron
wrote:

In article ,
"Avanti" wrote:


I forgot about centre counter or scandanavian only because after e4 d5 I
play e5 transposing into an advanced caro kann or french which then is not
so sharp immediately.


It doesn't transpose into either a caro-kann or french. Black gets the
best of both:

He can play his "bad" french bishop to f5 or g4 before playing -e6, and
the c-pawn is going to get to c5 in one move rather than two. If white
responded to the scandinavian with 2.e5 with any regularity, it would be
a much more popular opening.

The French can, too, be very sharp, but white has to co-operate-- eg if
he plays the exchange, well, it's not going to be super-sharp, now, is
it. But the Winawer poisoned pawn? They don't get much sharper. But in
most lines, white has a choice which will take all the "fun" out of the
opening:

the c3 sicilian, the four knights, etc etc etc.


Black can also avoid transpositions by playing 2...d4 or by playing
2...c5 followed by 3...d4.
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Old April 10th 04, 02:14 AM
Ron
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

In article ,
"Avanti" wrote:

"Ron" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Avanti" wrote:


I forgot about centre counter or scandanavian only because after e4 d5 I
play e5 transposing into an advanced caro kann or french which then is

not
so sharp immediately.


It doesn't transpose into either a caro-kann or french. Black gets the
best of both:

He can play his "bad" french bishop to f5


Then I play g4 and chase the bishop which loses lots of tempi before it gets
exchanged.


Basically, this is treating the position like a caro-kann. You can
chase the bishop back to g6 or h7 and exchange it, but unless black
castles kingside, you haven't neccesarily gained a whole lot. Those
advanced pawns can be weak in an endgame.

Also, compared to the caro-kann, black gets c7-c5 in only one move,
which means the white center will come under greater pressure. He
doesn't have to play Bf5 or e6 right away, either.

There's a reason why 1.e4 d5 is almost always met by 2.ed in top play.
You're simply giving black too many choices, too many opportunities to
turn the game into a more favorable version of a french or c-k.

-Ron
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Old April 10th 04, 02:52 PM
Arnold Meijster
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

Perhaps besides e5 and c5, Nf6 (Alekhine defence) is a nice try.
Most people know the book moves for e4 e5, and e4 c5, but not many not the
Alkehine moves.

"Rik" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play

agressive
and sharp lines?

Rik




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Old April 11th 04, 09:36 PM
SaltOfLife
 
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Default Black plays 1)....?

"Arnold Meijster" wrote in message ...
Perhaps besides e5 and c5, Nf6 (Alekhine defence) is a nice try.
Most people know the book moves for e4 e5, and e4 c5, but not many not the
Alkehine moves.

"Rik" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
What defense(s) does black have against 1) e4, being eager to play

agressive
and sharp lines?

Rik



Alekhine Defence certainly has good surprise value, but I'm not sure
it qualifies as a way to get sharp or aggressive play as Black. Most
lines, either theoretical or not, lead to rather strategic positions.
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