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Old April 9th 04, 07:06 PM
TruthXayer
 
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Default Kotovthinking methos....

Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?

thanks,
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Old April 10th 04, 06:23 AM
Mike Leahy
 
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Default Kotovthinking methos....

Kotov's thinking methods are what inspired me to write the Bookup program 21
years ago. I'd say it should be done at each tree node and at the end of
the branch.

One must at least lightly analyze the position at each node in order to come
up with a reasonable list of canididate moves. In a perfect world, one
would create a tree so deep that each leaf node of the tree would have a
clear assessment.

Mike Leahy
"The Database Man!"
www.bookup.com

"TruthXayer" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?

thanks,



  #3   Report Post  
Old April 10th 04, 04:43 PM
Tom Barnes
 
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Default Kotovthinking methos....

(TruthXayer) wrote in message . com...
Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?

thanks,


Many books have been written discussing Kotov's "tree analysis", for
example "Improve you chess NOW" by Jonathan Tisdall. There doesn't
seem to be just one way of analysing chess positions. Everyone is
different so if you read something in a book that doesn't make sense
to you then feel free to ignore it.

Regarding when to evaluate the position... Build up your tree and in
each branch stop (ie define a node) when:

1. You just can't (or don't have time to) continue since the position
is just too complicated
2. There are no immediate tactics left to calculate on

Then evaluate the position in each node. I don't see a reason to
evaluate intermediate positions leading to the nodes. Evaluating
positions resulting after the first case above is very different from
the second case.

In the first case you need to consider things like: how many pieces
are en-prise/how many pieces are protected, are there any pins on the
board, king safety etc. Its less important to look for double pawns,
bad bishops etc. Basically, in vague terms, see who's most vulnerable
to tactics.

In the second case follow the guidelines in Kotov's book and evaluate
the position based on positional properties such as: open files, pawn
structure, bad bishops, etc.
  #4   Report Post  
Old April 10th 04, 10:29 PM
Mike Leahy
 
Posts: n/a
Default Kotovthinking methos....

A Bookup customer just sent this Kotov quote:
"Look every time for the most fantastic possibilities on the board. This
stimulates imagination and assures the recognition of resources"

I guess that means he would have us analyze and consider everything we can
at each position.

Mike Leahy
"The Database Man!"
www.bookup.com

"Mike Leahy" wrote in message
...
Kotov's thinking methods are what inspired me to write the Bookup program

21
years ago. I'd say it should be done at each tree node and at the end of
the branch.

One must at least lightly analyze the position at each node in order to

come
up with a reasonable list of canididate moves. In a perfect world, one
would create a tree so deep that each leaf node of the tree would have a
clear assessment.

Mike Leahy
"The Database Man!"
www.bookup.com

"TruthXayer" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?

thanks,





  #5   Report Post  
Old April 11th 04, 08:23 AM
matt -`;'-
 
Posts: n/a
Default Kotovthinking methos....


"TruthXayer" wrote in message om...
Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?

thanks,


You may want to consider joining (for free) the CCC (Computer Chess Club) newsgroup:
http://www.talkchess.com/forums/1/index.html

There are a lot of knowledgeable and experienced programmers that can be found there.

-matt





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Old April 19th 04, 12:10 AM
Francesco Di Tolla
 
Posts: n/a
Default Kotovthinking methos....


"TruthXayer" ha scritto nel messaggio
om...
Hi,

I try analysing each tree with Kotov method. I am fine with the
material losses/etc but I am having trouble analysing the
positions(positional imbalances/etc) at each tree node. Should this be
done at every tree or at the end of each branch?


Many people have spent lot of ink about Kotov ideas: above all Tisdall in
Improve your chess now" (already quoted berfore in this thread), John Nunn
in "Secrect of practical chess" and Andy Soltis in "Inner Gamo of Chess".

My feeling about position evaluation of each node is that you don't evaluate
consciusly: when you play you "feel" each position you walk-trough in the
tree analysis.
When you get a doubled pawn, you always know it is a weaknes, or a potential
one. When you trade the bishop pair, or when you get an isolated pawn you
know the positional consequences.
The better you play, the more subtle factors you know without thinking to
much what positional effects produce.

How can one improve this aspect of the game? Anyone experienced this
before?


Lear from looking at commented games of the masters. When you don't
understand a move ask yourself what's happening a do some analysis yourself.
Try to learn by patterns.
Don't abuse of opening books.


  #8   Report Post  
Old April 19th 04, 02:52 PM
sathyashrayan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Kotovthinking methos....

Friends,
I certainly don't understand any of the above discussion about
improving
The positional thinking. Though I am a chess player I never come
across such
A word of the so and so thinking. Could any body mind giving me a hint
about the above subject?
  #9   Report Post  
Old April 19th 04, 06:53 PM
Mike Leahy
 
Posts: n/a
Default Kotovthinking methos....


"sathyashrayan" wrote in message
om...
Friends,
I certainly don't understand any of the above discussion about
improving
The positional thinking. Though I am a chess player I never come
across such
A word of the so and so thinking. Could any body mind giving me a hint
about the above subject?


Sure. Kotov wrote a book called "Think Like a Grandmaster" about what it
took him to become a grandmaster. He coined terms like "candidate move"
which is part of the jargon in Bookup. In fact his book inspired me to
write the Bookup program.

His approach is a no-nonsense method of choosing and analyzing lines. He
then published what he found and endured the criticisms of his readership
until he became an outstanding tactician. His stories are great reading
too!

Mike Leahy
"The Database Man!"
www.bookup.com




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