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Old September 9th 07, 06:18 AM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 5,365
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.

Chess Played at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

Yesterday "Stinky Garlnoot" and "apple3feet" beat Master and Normal
Levels.

See Recorded Games: http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10

As per my analysis the games played were Ok. But the result was
computer lost.

Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClub Chess is doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?

What weakness are you seeing in the Games played at GetClub Chess. Why
it is unable to beat the strong players? Is there any strategy mistake
or it is still making tactical mistake.

GetClub Chess thinks 8-10 depth (half move) deeper. Still it lose in
games with strong players. Are Strong players using Fritz8 or other
computer to play games at GetClub or they are finding the Getclub game
very weak.

So tell me the weaknesses you find in GetClub Chess so that I may
remove them.

Please tell, what should be improved in GetClub Chess

1. Depth of Moves
2. Game Strategy
3. Tactical Calculations
4. or Any other thing

See Recorded Games: http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10

I want to see GetClub Chess beat all the Players playing it, and not
only the weak players like me and my friends but also the strong
players like "Nomorechess", "Zebediah", "Stinky Garlnoot" and
"apple3feet" and "Taylor Kingston" .


Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

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Old September 9th 07, 06:23 AM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Sep 2007
Posts: 5
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

"Sanny" I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But
I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


You are an annoying retard.


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Old September 9th 07, 06:58 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,931
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

On Sep 9, 1:18 am, Sanny wrote:
I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.

Chess Played at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

Yesterday "Stinky Garlnoot" and "apple3feet" beat Master and Normal
Levels.

See Recorded Games:http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10

As per my analysis the games played were Ok.


No, Sanny. I looked at some of those games, and your program made
mistake after mistake, both tactically and strategically. In the
opening it wastes time, moving pieces to no purpose, even placing them
on squares where the opponent gains time for development by attacking
them. It fails to develop its own pieces. It weakens its pawn
structure by rash advances that leave its king vulnerable, or by
letting its pawns get doubled and/or isolated. In some cases it
obviously was not analyzing more than 3 or 4 ply ahead. It really does
not seem much improved at all compared to 6 months ago.

But the result was computer lost.


Yes, that's what happens when one plays badly.

Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClub Chess is doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?


Sanny, quit wasting your time asking this sort of question here.
Educate yourself about chess. Get some decent books and learn the
fundamentals of the game. And quit making ridiculous claims about your
inept program.

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Old September 9th 07, 09:32 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,305
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

Sanny wrote:
I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


Predicted by whom?

Only 1 poster here has predicted that the results would improve - and
that was you.


Chess Played at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

Yesterday "Stinky Garlnoot" and "apple3feet" beat Master and Normal
Levels.

See Recorded Games: http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10

As per my analysis the games played were Ok. But the result was
computer lost.


Your analysis is faulty.

I looked at the "Stinky Garlnoot" game. GetClub was positionally lost
after 10 moves. Count the number of moves that it takes to get from f1
to e2.


Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClub Chess is doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?


Because it makes weak moves.



What weakness are you seeing in the Games played at GetClub Chess. Why
it is unable to beat the strong players? Is there any strategy mistake
or it is still making tactical mistake.

GetClub Chess thinks 8-10 depth (half move) deeper. Still it lose in
games with strong players. Are Strong players using Fritz8 or other
computer to play games at GetClub or they are finding the Getclub game
very weak.


No one needs Fritz to beat GetClub. I think a 1980 Radio Shack portable
computer could beat GetClub.


So tell me the weaknesses you find in GetClub Chess so that I may
remove them.

Please tell, what should be improved in GetClub Chess

1. Depth of Moves
2. Game Strategy
3. Tactical Calculations
4. or Any other thing


Observing the stated time control


See Recorded Games: http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10

I want to see GetClub Chess beat all the Players playing it, and not
only the weak players like me and my friends but also the strong
players like "Nomorechess", "Zebediah", "Stinky Garlnoot" and
"apple3feet" and "Taylor Kingston" .


You don't always get what you want.


Bye
Sanny


Promises, promises...


Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html


Not until GetClub stops cheating.


--
Kenneth Sloan
Computer and Information Sciences +1-205-932-2213
University of Alabama at Birmingham FAX +1-205-934-5473
Birmingham, AL 35294-1170
http://www.cis.uab.edu/sloan/
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Old September 10th 07, 07:09 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 9,302
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

On Sep 9, 12:18 am, Sanny wrote:

I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClub Chess is doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?

What weakness are you seeing in the Games played at GetClub Chess. Why
it is unable to beat the strong players? Is there any strategy mistake
or it is still making tactical mistake.



In spite of comments which strongly imply a certain
depth of search, I find that the program is not even
aware of itself being checkmated until one or perhaps
two moves beforehand. This is good evidence that the
program is weak tactically, and until it can see simple
tactics like mate-in-two there is no reason to waste
time thinking about strategy or trying to punch in more
opening lines for it to play by rote.

Other Java applets play just fine, so I don't quite
understand why it is that with GetClub the applet
takes so long to load and then runs so s-l-o-w-l-y
and why there must be frequent disconnects, why
the Web site is so messed up, etc. A lot of time
has been spent to get the site where it is today (no
matter how sad that may be), so I understand the
reluctance to try another approach -- one where you
follow programming guidelines and test software for
bugs and so forth.

Let me suggest an experiment, whereby you can
keep your buggy Web site and your present chess
programs, and simply add a side project then. Set
up a new "level"; call it Fish Level and write the code
so the program only does two things:

1) generates a list of all legal moves in a given
position

and

2) use simple arithmetic to add up the values of
the men on the board, returning for instance the
value "0" for the starting position and "-1" where it
has lost a pawn.

Now, using only this simple arithmetic, analyze
the possible (legal) variations until a fixed depth
has been reached, and then have the program play
the move which nets the largest value in its own
favor. In other words, if it can grab the King, have
it grab the King; if it can take the enemy Queen,
have it do that, etc. Just look a few moves deep
and then play the best move it has found.

My prediction is that unless even this approach if
screwed up somehow, it will play better than what
you have now because it will *always* get the simple
tactics part of chess right.


-- help bot



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Old September 11th 07, 02:38 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 5,365
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.


In spite of comments which strongly imply a certain
depth of search, I find that the program is not even
aware of itself being checkmated until one or perhaps
two moves beforehand. This is good evidence that the
program is weak tactically, and until it can see simple
tactics like mate-in-two there is no reason to waste
time thinking about strategy or trying to punch in more
opening lines for it to play by rote.


It sees checkmates in 3 & 4 depending upon Level. But to complete a
game It waits till Mait in 2 is found. As opponent may miss a Maten in
4 While computer has seen it.

After looking your suggestions, The game was improved a bit today.
Lets see if it plays stronger moves now.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

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Old September 11th 07, 02:39 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 5,365
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

On Sep 9, 10:58 pm, Taylor Kingston wrote:
On Sep 9, 1:18 am, Sanny wrote:

I was thinking theGetClubChesswill win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


ChessPlayed at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html


Yesterday "Stinky Garlnoot" and "apple3feet" beat Master and Normal
Levels.


See Recorded Games:http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10


As per my analysis the games played were Ok.


No, Sanny. I looked at some of those games, and your program made
mistake after mistake, both tactically and strategically. In the
opening it wastes time, moving pieces to no purpose, even placing them
on squares where the opponent gains time for development by attacking
them. It fails to develop its own pieces. It weakens its pawn
structure by rash advances that leave its king vulnerable, or by
letting its pawns get doubled and/or isolated. In some cases it
obviously was not analyzing more than 3 or 4 ply ahead. It really does
not seem much improved at all compared to 6 months ago.

But the result was computer lost.


Yes, that's what happens when one plays badly.

Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClubChessis doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?


Sanny, quit wasting your time asking this sort of question here.
Educate yourself aboutchess. Get some decent books and learn the
fundamentals of the game. And quit making ridiculous claims about your
inept program.


After looking your suggestions, The game was improved a bit today.
Lets see if it plays stronger moves now.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

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Old September 11th 07, 02:39 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2006
Posts: 5,365
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

On Sep 10, 1:32 am, Kenneth Sloan wrote:
Sanny wrote:
I was thinking theGetClubChesswill win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


Predicted by whom?

Only 1 poster here has predicted that the results would improve - and
that was you.



ChessPlayed at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html


Yesterday "Stinky Garlnoot" and "apple3feet" beat Master and Normal
Levels.


See Recorded Games:http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10


As per my analysis the games played were Ok. But the result was
computer lost.


Your analysis is faulty.

I looked at the "Stinky Garlnoot" game. GetClubwas positionally lost
after 10 moves. Count the number of moves that it takes to get from f1
to e2.



Winners Go through the Recorded Games and tell me what mistake the
GetClubChessis doing. Why it is loosing to strong players?


Because it makes weak moves.



What weakness are you seeing in the Games played atGetClubChess. Why
it is unable to beat the strong players? Is there any strategy mistake
or it is still making tactical mistake.


GetClubChessthinks 8-10 depth (half move) deeper. Still it lose in
games with strong players. Are Strong players using Fritz8 or other
computer to play games atGetClubor they are finding theGetclubgame
very weak.


No one needs Fritz to beatGetClub. I think a 1980 Radio Shack portable
computer could beatGetClub.



So tell me the weaknesses you find inGetClubChessso that I may
remove them.


Please tell, what should be improved inGetClubChess


1. Depth of Moves
2. Game Strategy
3. Tactical Calculations
4. or Any other thing


Observing the stated time control



See Recorded Games:http://www.getclub.com/cc/showgame.php?num=10


I want to seeGetClubChessbeat all the Players playing it, and not
only the weak players like me and my friends but also the strong
players like "Nomorechess", "Zebediah", "Stinky Garlnoot" and
"apple3feet" and "Taylor Kingston" .


You don't always get what you want.



Bye
Sanny


Promises, promises...



PlayChessat:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html


Not untilGetClubstops cheating.

--
Kenneth Sloan
Computer and Information Sciences +1-205-932-2213
University of Alabama at Birmingham FAX +1-205-934-5473
Birmingham, AL 35294-1170 http://www.cis.uab.edu/sloan/



After looking your suggestions, The game was improved a bit today.
Lets see if it plays stronger moves now.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

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Old September 11th 07, 04:40 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,305
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

Sanny wrote:

After looking your suggestions, The game was improved a bit today.
Lets see if it plays stronger moves now.


Does your program still cheat?

--
Kenneth Sloan
Computer and Information Sciences +1-205-932-2213
University of Alabama at Birmingham FAX +1-205-934-5473
Birmingham, AL 35294-1170
http://www.cis.uab.edu/sloan/
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Old September 11th 07, 04:59 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Sep 2003
Posts: 268
Default Why are you Winning at GetClub Chess.

In rec.games.chess.computer Sanny wrote:
I was thinking the GetClub Chess will win a lot of games now, But I am
seeing that the results are not comming as predicted.


Sanjay -

Perhaps your team should get a chess player onboard and test it before you
release software. Better yet, build unit tests to test various functions in
the engine so that you KNOW before you release that your software at least
does the things you expect it to do under the test conditions. You will get a
lot less heat from the people in this group if you put a little QC around your
product.

--
Thomas T. Veldhouse

We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the
machinations of the wicked.

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