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Old May 10th 04, 06:27 PM
newman
 
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Default cheating software

I have heard from several people that there is software that can
detect whether an internet opponent is cheating. Does this software
really work? Seems to me, it would seem very difficult to determine
whether someone is cheating.
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Old May 10th 04, 07:05 PM
Amos Soma
 
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Default cheating software

It's not specific software you can buy. Many internet chess servers (like
ICC) will detect if you have a chess program (like Fritz) running in the
background. If you continually switch to this program while playing a game
online, they will flag you as a cheater. They will prevent you from playing
on their server until you explain to them why you were constantly switching
between programs while playing. There are other ways they can attempt to
detect cheaters as well.

"newman" wrote in message
om...
I have heard from several people that there is software that can
detect whether an internet opponent is cheating. Does this software
really work? Seems to me, it would seem very difficult to determine
whether someone is cheating.



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Old May 10th 04, 11:05 PM
Daniel Lidstrom
 
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Default cheating software

On Mon, 10 May 2004 14:05:01 -0400, Amos Soma wrote:

"newman" wrote in message
om...
I have heard from several people that there is software that can
detect whether an internet opponent is cheating. Does this software
really work? Seems to me, it would seem very difficult to determine
whether someone is cheating.

It's not specific software you can buy. Many internet chess servers (like
ICC) will detect if you have a chess program (like Fritz) running in the
background. If you continually switch to this program while playing a game
online, they will flag you as a cheater. They will prevent you from playing
on their server until you explain to them why you were constantly switching
between programs while playing. There are other ways they can attempt to
detect cheaters as well.


What is cheating? If you're playing a human with 2500 rank, why would you
expect even a close game? Play the people of your skill, and you will have
close games.

--
Daniel
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet?

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Old May 11th 04, 09:13 AM
Damir Ulovec
 
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Default cheating software

Yes... But what if opponent have 2 computers (or other kind of computer
assistant) and additional chess software running on second computer? I've
played several games against ~1600 player (about my rank), and I've lose
every game. After detail analyze I discovered that he's using additional
software... Every move was almost "perfect", played in just a few seconds
except one, where was more time spent. But he was not flaged as cheater.
And what if (for example) I chat with friend on ICQ or NetMeeting (or
PalTalk, or whatever) about usual stuff, and playing a game at the same
time?

"Amos Soma" wrote in message
...
It's not specific software you can buy. Many internet chess servers (like
ICC) will detect if you have a chess program (like Fritz) running in the
background. If you continually switch to this program while playing a game
online, they will flag you as a cheater. They will prevent you from

playing
on their server until you explain to them why you were constantly

switching
between programs while playing. There are other ways they can attempt to
detect cheaters as well.



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Old May 11th 04, 11:38 AM
Gunny Bunny
 
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Default cheating software


"CeeBee" wrote in message
.67...
"Damir Ulovec" wrote in
rec.games.chess.computer:

Yes... But what if opponent have 2 computers (or other kind of
computer assistant) and additional chess software running on second
computer?


Most servers use two cheattrap: one is looking for task switching,
followed by a warning and a request for an explanation, the second is
software that analysis games and determines playing styles. It can pick
out computer style play.

If you lose to someone who's obviously cheating, put him or her on your
noplay list, and forget about it. Why would you want to make a fuss over
losers.


That is the worst thing you can do.

We should report them to ComputerAbuse(*) or talk to the Admin(*) !!




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Old May 12th 04, 12:23 AM
yves
 
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Default cheating software

CeeBee wrote:

Most servers use two cheattrap: one is looking for task switching,
followed by a warning and a request for an explanation, the second is
software that analysis games and determines playing styles. It can pick
out computer style play.


Very interesting to know that such a thing exists. How can task
switching be monitored by an internet server? How are computers traced?
A lot of computer programmes have styles that come very close to human
styles and with the hundreds of chess computer programmes available, it
is impossible to try each position out in each engine in order to find
which actually played.

While for me this is a non-topic because I am not interested in others
performance and only that I play a nice game, I am still very interested
on how such spy software actually works.

Yves

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Old May 12th 04, 05:27 AM
Sidney
 
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Default cheating software

"CeeBee" wrote
Most servers use two cheattrap: one is looking for task switching,
followed by a warning and a request for an explanation, the second is
software that analysis games and determines playing styles. It can pick
out computer style play.

If you lose to someone who's obviously cheating, put him or her on your
noplay list, and forget about it. Why would you want to make a fuss over
losers.


Very interesting. But how much stock do you put into the second one? I mean, a
move 'could' look like a computer made it, but would a server really be able to
detect it, and if it did think it was a computer move, actually flag someone for
doing a move which could be made on his own?


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Old May 12th 04, 09:40 AM
David Richerby
 
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Default cheating software

yves wrote:
CeeBee wrote:
Most servers use two cheattrap: one is looking for task switching,
followed by a warning and a request for an explanation, the second
is software that analysis games and determines playing styles. It
can pick out computer style play.


Very interesting to know that such a thing exists. How can task
switching be monitored by an internet server?


It can't unless there is something running on the client machine. So,
for example, Playchess.com *could* do this (I have no idea if they do
or not) because you have to connect to their server through Fritz or
one of its friends. FICS, on the other hand, cannot, because you can
connect to it with any software you like, such as Win/Xboard or even
telnet.


How are computers traced? A lot of computer programmes have styles
that come very close to human styles and with the hundreds of chess
computer programmes available, it is impossible to try each position
out in each engine in order to find which actually played.


This is surely something that can only be done after an accusation of
cheating has been made. It would be infeasible to monitor all the
games being played on a server in real time in this way. So, if some-
body has been accused of cheating, the server administrators might
examine the games to see if they look like computer games.


Dave.

--
David Richerby Miniature Spoon (TM): it's like a
www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ piece of cutlery but you can hold in
it your hand!
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Old May 12th 04, 01:17 PM
newman
 
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Default cheating software

I have a hard time believing that there is software that can analyse
the moves played and accurately determine if they are made by a
program.

What would the criteria be? I guess you can look for games that do
not include gross blunders, although I have played a few games (ok,
very few - lol) where I have not made any nasty mistakes. Would I be
punished for my good performance?

I will take this argument one step further and assert that cheating is
not as common as we think it is. Most chess player hate to lose.
When it happens, we naturally come up with every imaginable excuse for
our defeat other than the fact that we were simply outplayed. And the
internet provides us with the perfect excuse for our defeats - "my
opponent probably cheated."

Lets say that my online opponent has a rating of 1400-1600. We should
be very slow to point fingers at that person. If he was a cheater,
wouldn't his rating be over 2000?

I understand that there will always be cheaters in chess, but it is
not that much of a problem. As for me, I am going to focus on my own
improvement rather than somebody else's alleged ill-gotten victories.
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Old May 12th 04, 05:11 PM
Daniel Lidstrom
 
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Default cheating software

On Wed, 12 May 2004 05:17:04 -0700, newman wrote:

I have a hard time believing that there is software that can analyse
the moves played and accurately determine if they are made by a
program.

What would the criteria be? I guess you can look for games that do
not include gross blunders, although I have played a few games (ok,
very few - lol) where I have not made any nasty mistakes. Would I be
punished for my good performance?

I will take this argument one step further and assert that cheating is
not as common as we think it is. Most chess player hate to lose.
When it happens, we naturally come up with every imaginable excuse for
our defeat other than the fact that we were simply outplayed. And the
internet provides us with the perfect excuse for our defeats - "my
opponent probably cheated."

Lets say that my online opponent has a rating of 1400-1600. We should
be very slow to point fingers at that person. If he was a cheater,
wouldn't his rating be over 2000?

I understand that there will always be cheaters in chess, but it is
not that much of a problem. As for me, I am going to focus on my own
improvement rather than somebody else's alleged ill-gotten victories.


I agree with you completely. If a chess server has software to determine
if you are a cheater or not, I suggest you switch to another server.

--
Daniel


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