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Old August 30th 08, 06:01 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

Sanny;

I meant to ask you this last week before I left, but I got busy...

Do you want any more test positions to go along with the WAC you are
currently using?

I was thinking I could browse around the web and Dann's collection and see
what I could find that might be useful.

(Incidentally, Dann has a lot of EPD tests at http://cap.connx.com/EPD/ but
most of them are pretty difficult positions.)

I'm thinking perhaps shallow tactics, simple mates, and maybe a few
contrived test positions.

Things that should be simple enough that your beginner level should get 90%
on, with the remainder probably being deeper mates.

Nothing truely complicated. Simple enough that a program shouldn't miss
them.

They might make a good self check test suite. Something you can run after
ever change to the program and if something fails, then it means you broke
something.

Would you be interested?

It would take me at least a week to come up with some (busy with other
things), but if you are interested, I'm willing to see what I can find.


If anybody else has some good basic test positions, feel free to post them
too.






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Old August 30th 08, 06:15 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

Would you be interested?

It would take me at least a week to come up with some (busy with other
things), but if you are interested, I'm willing to see what I can find.



Yes, do send them. But in the same format as the WAC test.

I have not tested WAC recently. I think I should first test the WAC
again as the game was corrected recently.

I have to see how good the Beginner Level is at WAC test now. I will
do the test tommorow.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

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Old September 2nd 08, 01:07 AM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

Sanny;

I'm havint trouble coming up with some tactical positions that would be simple enough for GC, but yet still good enough to be worthwhile.

I would suggest you go over to Dann Corbit's site http://cap.connx.com/EPD/ and download something like r12345.epd and tactics.epd

(Those will be bzip2'ed. It's a common form of compression like .zip is, except much higher compression ratios. If you don't have a zip program that can handle it, you might want to try 7zip or some such free program.)

Here are some that I've salvaged from some other test files I had.

I got rid of most of the tactical ones because they were too difficult. Too big of a chance GC wouldn't find the right move because it doesn't search deep enough. (And with tactical positions, too great a risk that a good program would search deep enough to find a better move.)

I also got rid of most of the positional stuff. Too objective and GC might not find the right one considering it searches so slowly.

I am left with a few mates and some drawing positions.

The drawing positions are useful. A number of draw by repetition ones, and way at the bottom, a couple FEN positions (to enter manually) that set up some games for 50 move rule testing.

I would expect GC to be able to find all the mates through 4 even on the easiest level.

Between these and the WAC positions, that should be enough for you for a while.

You still need to work on the program's speed, as well as being able to do by time. Most of these test positions should be solvable with no more than 10 seconds searching.



; Repeat 3x
3N2nk/P5pp/3B4/1r1B4/8/P7/8/K1r5 w - - bm a1a2; c0 "draw by repetition";
6k1/1R5p/7Q/3q4/8/7P/6PK/8 b - - bm Qd5-e5+!;
8/8/8/1p6/1P1P4/1K1Q4/2r5/2k5 b - - bm Rc2-b2+!;
q4rnk/1R6/p1P5/8/K7/1PP5/1PR5/1nr5 w - - bm Rc2-h2+!;
q3r1nk/1R6/p1P5/8/K7/1PP5/1PR5/1nr5 w - - bm Rc2-h2+!;
q2r2nk/1R6/p1P5/8/K7/1PP5/1PR5/1nr5 w - - bm Rc2-h2+!;
8/1k6/8/8/2p5/n2p4/PN1P4/1QK5 w - - bm Nb2xc4+!;
8/4bK1k/npp4p/3p4/4p3/5nR1/8/8 w - - bm Rg3-g7+!;
rB3NBR/5p1Q/5Pp1/4r1P1/5k1P/8/8/7K b - - bm Ra8-a1+!; c0 "7 moves to 3 x repeat";
rB3NBR/5p1Q/3r1Pp1/4k1P1/7P/8/8/7K b - - bm Ra8-a1+!; c0 "11(?) moves to 3 x repeat";
rB3NBR/2r2p1Q/3k1Pp1/6P1/7P/8/8/7K b - - bm Ra8-a1+!; c0 "19(?) moves to 3 x repeat";


; mate in 1
7k/8/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7 g2g8 ; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.1" ;
7k/6p1/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;
7b/5P1k/7p/8/8/8/8/3K2R1 w - - bm f7f8N; c0 "Mate in 1 with subpromotion"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;

; Mate in 2
8/8/8/8/3P2R1/6K1/8/7k w - - bm rg4e4 ; c0 "Mate in 2"; id "Mate-in-2.1" ;
7k/2P5/7p/8/8/8/8/K5R1 w - - bm c7c8Q c7c8R ; c0 "Mate in 2"; id "Mate-in-2.2" ;
3R4/N2p1B2/8/2p1kp2/2PRb3/B2pQ3/3N4/3K4 w - - bm e3g5; c0 "Mate in 2"; id "Mate-in-2.4" ;
8/P6k/1Bp5/5Kp1/4n3/1P2Q3/3q4/8 b - - bm d2d7; c0 "Mate in 2"; id "Mate-in-2.5";

; mate in 3
3B1rk1/1B2bNpp/1pP2p2/pp5n/5n1r/RQP3Pq/R4P1P/6K1 w - - bm f7h6; c0 "Mate in 3"; id "Mate-in-3.1";

; Mate in 4
8/8/K7/1R6/kb6/1p6/1P6/1B6 w - - bm b5g5; c0 "Mate in 4"; c1 "Multiple solutions"; id "Mate-in-4.1" ;
Bq1B1K2/3PpN2/P3Pp2/P1p2P2/2Pk1b1R/1p6/pN1P1P2/QR6 w - - bm a6a7; c0 "Mate in 4"; id "Mate-in-4.1" ;
r1bq3r/3pb1pp/p4n2/2p1k3/1p2P3/7Q/PPP2PPP/RNB2RK1 w - - bm Bc1f4+ ; c0 "Mate in 4"; id "Mate-in-4.2";
4r3/2P2k2/8/8/8/1p1p4/1P1P4/QRKR3Q w - - c0 "Mate in 4";

; mate in 6
8/1k1K4/8/8/1pN5/1N6/8/8 w - - bm Nc5+; id "VA.19, Taken from 'Knight Endings', diag.132"; c0 "mate in 6";
r3nrk1/p1qp1b1p/6pp/2b3P1/1QP2P2/2BP2P1/P1N2N2/1K3R2 w - - bm f2g4; c0 "Mate in 6" ;


; Mate in 7
1k6/4K3/8/1B1N4/8/8/8/8 w - - bm Ba6; id "VA.23, Taken from 'Endgame theory', diag.4"; c0 "mate in 7";
3r1rk1/1p3pnp/p3pBp1/1qPpP3/1P1P2R1/P2Q3R/6PP/6K1 w - - bm Rxh7; c0 "Mate in 7 moves"; id "BT2450-14";
4k3/nnnnnnnn/8/8/8/8/RRRRRRRR/4K3 w - - bm Rxc7; id "VA.Bizarre.01"; c0 "mate in 7: c2xc7, b7d6, h2xh7, d6f5, f2xf5, a7c6, g2xg7, f7e5, h7h8+, e7g8, h8xg8+, d7f8, g8f8#";
r1N5/2N5/7R/k7/p6r/Bp1p2p1/pKp4b/n1n2b2 w - - bm h6g6; c0 "Mate in 7" ;
8/1B4N1/8/4k3/1B6/4K2N/8/8 w - - bm Nh3f4; id "VA.24, by Valentin Albillo"; c0 "mate in 7";
4k3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - bm e4; id "VA.12, Problem proposed by Henry Dudeney"; c0 "mate in 7";


; mate in 8
4k3/8/1p1p1p1p/pPpPpPpP/P1P1P1P1/8/8/2BQK3 w - - bm c1xg5; c0 "mate in 8";


; mate in 9
3n4/8/n6p/2p2K1k/1b6/2p3P1/2B1p3/8 w - - bm Be4; id "VA.27, Final part of a study of Gijs van Breukelen"; c0 "mate in 9";
r1b2k1r/p4pbp/nq1p1Q2/2pP4/1p2R2N/6P1/P3PPBP/4K2R w K - bm Qe7+; id "VA.26, Cukierman vs. Tartakover"; c0 "mate in 9: 1. Qf6-e7+ Kf8-g8 2. Qe7-e8+ Bg7-f8";
RnBqkBnR/PPppppPP/8/8/8/8/ppPPPPpp/rNbQKbNr w - - bm h7xg8=N; id "VA.Bizarre.04, 'Melee'"; c0 "mate in 9";


; mate in 10
rnbq1b1r/p1pp1p1p/4k3/1p1NP1p1/2QP1p2/5N2/PP1B1KPP/n6R w - - bm Nxg5+; id "VA.11, Position taken from 'Chess skills in man and machine', Fig.8.1"; c0 "mate in 10";
4r1k1/rp2Bppp/p1b5/1q2Q3/R7/1P5P/P4PP1/3R2K1 w - - id "Enrique: Mate in 10 -"; bm Qxg7;
7K/6Q1/8/8/8/3k4/8/8 w - - bm Qb2; id "VA.10, Position taken from 'How computers play chess'"; c0 "mate in 10";

; mate in 11
6k1/1p3pPp/pr1pbBp1/q3p3/4P1P1/P1r2P2/1PPQB3/1K1R3R w - - bm Be2b5; c0 "mate in 11"; c1 "how long to resolve mate?";

; mate in 12

; mate in 13
rnbQKbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBqkBNR w - - bm Nc3; id "VA.Unsolved.02, 'Surrounded'"; c0 "mate in 12";
r5k1/7p/2pP2pP/1p6/1q3B2/1p2Q1P1/1P6/rNK1R2R b - - bm Rxb1+; id "VA.13, Westler vs. Dr. Krejcik, Viena 1931"; c0 "mate in 13: 1. Ra1xb1+ Kc1xb1 2. Ra8-a1+ Kb1xa1";
8/2pPpP2/1P1qk1p1/1p4P1/1P4p1/1p1QK1P1/2PpPp2/8 w - - bm f8=Q; id "VA.Bizarre.05, 'The Ring'"; c0 "mate in 13";



; 50 move rule
3B4/7k/7p/7P/8/5K2/8/1N6 w - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";
8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";


"Sanny" wrote in message ...
Would you be interested?

It would take me at least a week to come up with some (busy with other
things), but if you are interested, I'm willing to see what I can find.



Yes, do send them. But in the same format as the WAC test.

I have not tested WAC recently. I think I should first test the WAC
again as the game was corrected recently.

I have to see how good the Beginner Level is at WAC test now. I will
do the test tommorow.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html


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Old September 2nd 08, 03:58 AM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

* Guest (02:07) schrieb:

So, you are avoiding line breaks by having very long lines now? :-)

And please turn off HTML.

The drawing positions are useful. A number of draw by repetition ones,
and way at the bottom, a couple FEN positions (to enter manually) that
set up some games for 50 move rule testing.


I skip them all since Finalfun doesn't understand that.

; mate in 1


In all the mating positions you don't give the best move in SAN, that
makes it kind of hard to read.

7k/8/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7 g2g8 ; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.1" ;
7k/6p1/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;
7b/5P1k/7p/8/8/8/8/3K2R1 w - - bm f7f8N; c0 "Mate in 1 with subpromotion"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;


Major bug found: Finalfun finds 1.2 if it started fresh, but if it tries
1.1 first its totally confused.

; Mate in 2
8/8/8/8/3P2R1/6K1/8/7k w - - bm rg4e4 ; c0 "Mate in 2"; id "Mate-in-2.1" ;


Here it's totally confused even when started fresh.

I'm giving up. My latest changes to try to fix the bug seem to have
totally ****ed it up. That happens if you don't do tests. :-(

8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";


That's not FEN, there's no half move clock there.

mfg, simon .... l
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Old September 2nd 08, 02:57 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?


"Simon Krahnke" wrote in message
...
* Guest (02:07) schrieb:

So, you are avoiding line breaks by having very long lines now? :-)


Yup. I did it specifically for you...

And please turn off HTML.


That was the only way to guarantee the lines wouldn't be broken. Didn't
want you to be unhappy.

Since this isn't a binary newsgroup, I figured I wouldn't be able to attach
it, so HTML was the only chance to keep you from complaining.

; mate in 1


In all the mating positions you don't give the best move in SAN, that
makes it kind of hard to read.


I didn't write them. I just cut & pasted and then tested them. I ran them
through a couple programs just to make sure they were what they said they
were. (A couple weren't.)

All the moves are in legal form, just not common form.

Most chess programs should be able to handle the moves. Humans are often
inconsistant, so they need a bit of flexibility anyway. (At least these
aren't in old descriptive notation!)


7k/8/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7 g2g8 ; c0 "Mate in 1"; id
"Mate-in-1.1" ;
7k/6p1/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.2"
;
7b/5P1k/7p/8/8/8/8/3K2R1 w - - bm f7f8N; c0 "Mate in 1 with
subpromotion"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;


Major bug found: Finalfun finds 1.2 if it started fresh, but if it tries
1.1 first its totally confused.


If you are finding bugs in these few, you should grab a few from Dann's
site.

The next time I do a chess program, I'm going to have a much larger
selection of test positions to run once a week.



8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";


That's not FEN, there's no half move clock there.


The move clocks are optional for FEN.

Technically it's not fen because there's a comment there. Could be EPD
without a best move, of course.





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Old September 2nd 08, 04:05 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

* Guest (15:57) schrieb:

"Simon Krahnke" wrote in message
...
* Guest (02:07) schrieb:

So, you are avoiding line breaks by having very long lines now? :-)


Yup. I did it specifically for you...

And please turn off HTML.


That was the only way to guarantee the lines wouldn't be broken. Didn't
want you to be unhappy.


Didn't help. I had trouble to handle that HTML.

Since this isn't a binary newsgroup, I figured I wouldn't be able to attach
it, so HTML was the only chance to keep you from complaining.


I doubt that OE is that broken. Anyway, it's your choice to use that crap.

All the moves are in legal form, just not common form.


No, the best has to be given in SAN.

Most chess programs should be able to handle the moves. Humans are often
inconsistant, so they need a bit of flexibility anyway. (At least these
aren't in old descriptive notation!)


:-)

Arena 1.1 doesn't try to parse any opcode fields. It puts them all in
the best move field, after removing the first opcode.

7k/8/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7 g2g8 ; c0 "Mate in 1"; id
"Mate-in-1.1" ;
7k/6p1/7p/8/8/8/6Q1/K5R1 w - - bm g2g7; c0 "Mate in 1"; id "Mate-in-1.2"
;
7b/5P1k/7p/8/8/8/8/3K2R1 w - - bm f7f8N; c0 "Mate in 1 with
subpromotion"; id "Mate-in-1.2" ;


Major bug found: Finalfun finds 1.2 if it started fresh, but if it tries
1.1 first its totally confused.


If you are finding bugs in these few, you should grab a few from Dann's
site.


I reverted my latest changes. Most of the bugs are gone now. I have to
fix that old bug, it surely plays in a role in mate scores too.

The next time I do a chess program, I'm going to have a much larger
selection of test positions to run once a week.


Yes, one should automate that.

8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";


That's not FEN, there's no half move clock there.


The move clocks are optional for FEN.


No, they aren't. There's nothing optional in FEN.

Technically it's not fen because there's a comment there. Could be EPD
without a best move, of course.


Yeah, but the half move clock is kind of essential here, unless you want
the search to go to a depth of 100 plies.

mfg, simon .... l
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Old September 2nd 08, 05:05 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

"Simon Krahnke" wrote in message
...
* Guest (15:57) schrieb:

"Simon Krahnke" wrote in message
...
* Guest (02:07) schrieb:

So, you are avoiding line breaks by having very long lines now? :-)


Yup. I did it specifically for you...

And please turn off HTML.


That was the only way to guarantee the lines wouldn't be broken. Didn't
want you to be unhappy.


Didn't help. I had trouble to handle that HTML.


Like you suggest below.... Get a better newsreader that can... If whatever
"crap" you use can't, then that's your problem.


Since this isn't a binary newsgroup, I figured I wouldn't be able to
attach
it, so HTML was the only chance to keep you from complaining.


I doubt that OE is that broken. Anyway, it's your choice to use that crap.


It's not the newsreader but the newsgroup provider.

If a newsgroup isn't indicated as being for binaries, many will block
attachments from being posted, and/or even strip them out when you try to
download.

That helps cut down on the spam and viruses that get posted.

I don't know if this one blocks attachments being posted, but it sure looks
like it blocks them on download.



All the moves are in legal form, just not common form.


No, the best has to be given in SAN.

Most chess programs should be able to handle the moves. Humans are often
inconsistant, so they need a bit of flexibility anyway. (At least these
aren't in old descriptive notation!)


:-)


I don't know if you've ever tried to program for descriptive notation, but
it sure is fun.... If you are a masochist.

You basically have to try and prove an entered move isn't one on the legal
move list. You have to do it by process of elimination.

And converting to descriptive notation is similar. You fully describe it
and then you start removing information until you can no longer properly
decode it, then back up to the last one that worked.


The next time I do a chess program, I'm going to have a much larger
selection of test positions to run once a week.


Yes, one should automate that.


I used to have a dozen or so simple positions programmed into mine. Along
with with a half dozen or so PERFT positions.

That way I could do the "selftest" command whenever I wanted to.

It wasn't extensive, but it was easy and it caught the simple stuff.


8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";

That's not FEN, there's no half move clock there.


The move clocks are optional for FEN.


No, they aren't. There's nothing optional in FEN.


Yes they are optional.

Also, many programs don't parse them right anyway.

And winboard / xboard & Arena (you said) don't pass them to the program.
(Which is probably why most programs don't bother with them.)


Technically it's not fen because there's a comment there. Could be EPD
without a best move, of course.


Yeah, but the half move clock is kind of essential here, unless you want
the search to go to a depth of 100 plies.


That is part of the test, actually.

But feel free to add it if you want. Makes no great difference to me.






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Old September 2nd 08, 11:26 PM posted to rec.games.chess.computer
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Default Sanny: Do you want more test positions?

* Guest (18:05) schrieb:

"Simon Krahnke" wrote

Didn't help. I had trouble to handle that HTML.


Like you suggest below.... Get a better newsreader that can... If whatever
"crap" you use can't, then that's your problem.


There was never any useful content in an HTML article before. Surely
there is some way to display the plain text part, I just don't know it.
I finally managed to save it in rmail format and edit my way from there.

Since this isn't a binary newsgroup, I figured I wouldn't be able to
attach it, so HTML was the only chance to keep you from complaining.


I doubt that OE is that broken. Anyway, it's your choice to use that crap.


It's not the newsreader but the newsgroup provider.

If a newsgroup isn't indicated as being for binaries, many will block
attachments from being posted, and/or even strip them out when you try to
download.


Yeah, some dumb filters will do that. But no server complains about long
lines. I for example have no problem posting articles in which some
lines are longer than 80 characters while regular text is broken down to
multiple lines.

All the moves are in legal form, just not common form.


No, the best has to be given in SAN.


No, it has to.

Most chess programs should be able to handle the moves. Humans are often
inconsistant, so they need a bit of flexibility anyway. (At least these
aren't in old descriptive notation!)


:-)


I don't know if you've ever tried to program for descriptive notation, but
it sure is fun.... If you are a masochist.


It's no so much more troublesome as SAN.

You basically have to try and prove an entered move isn't one on the legal
move list. You have to do it by process of elimination.


That's how I do it with SAN: I generate a list of legal moves and then
compare each one with the SAN string. The first move that matches is the
right one. Of course this assumes the SAN string is legal representation
of a single legal move. If you need to check for illegal input you need
to check for ambiguity too.

And converting to descriptive notation is similar. You fully describe it
and then you start removing information until you can no longer properly
decode it, then back up to the last one that worked.


I have a move formatter that takes several parameters, one of them being
the type. When I format a move for SAN I go through the types SAN_MIN,
SAN_FILE, SAN_RANK and SAN_MAX, format a string and compare with every
move in the list of legal moves. When it only compares true to the move
to be formatted the iteration is stopped and the string returned.

8/7k/7p/6BP/8/5K2/8/1N6 b - - c0 "draw by 50 move rule";

That's not FEN, there's no half move clock there.

The move clocks are optional for FEN.


No, they aren't. There's nothing optional in FEN.


Yes they are optional.


No, they aren't.

Also, many programs don't parse them right anyway.


I consider that a bug in these programs.

And winboard / xboard & Arena (you said) don't pass them to the program.
(Which is probably why most programs don't bother with them.)


True. But my Finalfun does parse them.

Technically it's not fen because there's a comment there. Could be EPD
without a best move, of course.


Yeah, but the half move clock is kind of essential here, unless you want
the search to go to a depth of 100 plies.


That is part of the test, actually.


Searching 100 plies deep? What engine on the world does that?

But feel free to add it if you want. Makes no great difference to me.


???

mfg, simon .... l
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