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Old October 20th 04, 01:27 PM
Chess One
 
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Default Crossing Crossville

I don't know if the Crossville decision makes any sense whatever based on
evidence of the mishmash of reports here.

On the face of it people seem to have made their decision in a hurry for no
apparent reason, informed by wildly conflicting reports of the 3 sites, and
without stating what goal is to be achieved by any move.

The property rate for TN seems very high for a 'rural' district. I am
comparing it with local rates for professional offices in my own town of
about the same size as Crossville, and which is also a non-metro area. You
can purchase two town houses, each of 2,000 square feet, for about $125k
each, which appears to discount the TN rate by 40%.

Our town has 3 interstate exits, 90 minutes from an international airport,
and 2 hrs from Logan/Boston, and is settled with various people who come
here for the arts and general amenities, which is also a reason cited by
business owners for relocation.

Spotted recently were Whoopi Goldberg, Saul Bellow, Misha Barysnikov and Ken
Burns. The Museum is currently hosting a Warhol festival from NY City [a
coup for the museum, the exhibit is a rare event anywhere], and every year
there is a literary festival drawing people from all over New England.

The population is 12,000 residents, grand list of 5,500, and with a day-time
population of almost 25,000.

Marlboro College has a graduate department for Internet studies, and there
are more cyber-people in town than shrinks! The World Learning Institute is
situated near Kipling's house, Naulakha, and can translate any of 57
languages. An outfit called VABEC runs PhD programs, and has the best
teleconferencing studio in the USA (much used by educators and medical
types).

There are 2,000,000 square feet of available wharehousing in the town, as
well as concommitant office spaces to serve it. Leasing better office space
of 4,000 sq ft might cost $40,000 per year. The entire town is designated as
America's first free-trade zone [any property can qualify] supported by the
chief government employee in the state and the governor.

Vermont as a desirable location always comes within the top 3 states in any
poll.

--------

But!

What I have not read here is a side-by-side comparison of sites that is not
contradicted by the decision-makers themselves!

(as if various people were voting from completely different sets of
information)

And which also addresses real needs of USCF, now and in a few years. I have
read happy abstractions, but as explanations for a strategic move of HQ they
are anodyne, and what is not at all clear is if the writers are writing-down
in public, or if what they have written constitutes their thinking entire.

A minimum set of items to address must be:-

i) How much work can be achieved by tele-commuting?
ii) What is the staffing need overall?
iii) What staff are identified to be absolutely necessary to USCF's office
/in situ/ and what work will they do?
iv) How much space needs be allocated to these staff? [Sam Sloan's question]
vi) In 5 years time, what are the identified spatial requirements for a USCF
office?
vii) What predicates metro versus rural location? [Larry Parr's question]


Phil Innes
Brattleboro, Vermont



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Old October 20th 04, 11:01 PM
StanB
 
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"Chess One" wrote in message
news:[email protected]

The property rate for TN seems very high for a 'rural' district. I am
comparing it with local rates for professional offices in my own town of
about the same size as Crossville, and which is also a non-metro area. You
can purchase two town houses, each of 2,000 square feet, for about $125k
each, which appears to discount the TN rate by 40%.


Dubious in any place but the sticks. My house is 2400 sq ft and could bring
450k. That's what similar homes are bringing. 1,100 ft townhomes are
bringing in the high 200s around here.

My house is in the middle left of the pic, just above and right of the
upside down seven.

http://terraserver-usa.com/image.asp...11138&z=18&w=1


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Old October 20th 04, 11:04 PM
StanB
 
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"Chess One" wrote in message
news:[email protected]

vii) What predicates metro versus rural location? [Larry Parr's question]


The subject of the predicate is often understood. Stop.



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Old October 21st 04, 12:09 AM
Mike Murray
 
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Default

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:01:18 -0400, "StanB"
wrote:

My house is in the middle left of the pic, just above and right of the
upside down seven.


http://terraserver-usa.com/image.asp...11138&z=18&w=1


Your lawn needs mowing.

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Old October 21st 04, 02:00 PM
Chess One
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"StanB" wrote in message
...

"Chess One" wrote in message
news:[email protected]

The property rate for TN seems very high for a 'rural' district. I am
comparing it with local rates for professional offices in my own town of
about the same size as Crossville, and which is also a non-metro area.
You
can purchase two town houses, each of 2,000 square feet, for about $125k
each, which appears to discount the TN rate by 40%.


Dubious in any place but the sticks. My house is 2400 sq ft and could
bring 450k. That's what similar homes are bringing. 1,100 ft townhomes are
bringing in the high 200s around here.

My house is in the middle left of the pic, just above and right of the
upside down seven.

http://terraserver-usa.com/image.asp...11138&z=18&w=1


Stan, I expected to see a nice pic of a shuttered duplex, kennel out back, a
few okay shrubs, and maybe a kid learning to ride a training wheel bike. But
you live in a zeppelin!

Away from metro areas costs are very much less. I even calculated that USCF
could almost pay a lease from the /interest/ of the building sale here.

But we have more expensive real estate too, and pre-governor Arnold bought a
lake-lot which cost several times more than your house. In the most
desirable areas general contractors sometimes remove the old house entirely,
even if it cost a million, and rebuild a new 'palace'. They call these
properties 'scrapers'.

Try an on-line realtor in Vermont and look at towns called Manchester,
Dorset or Norwich, where the lot price is likely to be 400k. House is extra.

Phil





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Old October 24th 04, 06:13 AM
Parrthenon
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Tim Hanke cast the decisive vote to move to Crossville without delaying the
vote for two weeks to explore whether a generous offer from a billionaire
philanthropist who lives near New Windsor was feasible. Recently he stated he
wouldn't accept the Liberty site even if it was given to the USCF for free.
However, a realtor's report submitted to the board before the vote was taken
states that the site is worth in excess of $500,000!

As a candidate Mr. Hanke was opposed to Crossville. Was he right then and wrong
now? Or wrong now and right then?

From: Tim Hanke )
Subject: Questions for T. Hanke & S. Sloan

rec.games.chess.misc, rec.games.chess.politics
Date: 2003-06-14 13:52:58 PST

"Gunny Bunny" wrote ...
1) Why is the USCF moving ? Especially to Tennessee ?


I believe the USCF is moving in large part to shed payroll without having to
fire employees. The move can be expected to lead to many staff quitting who
might otherwise have had to be fired. Also, morale has been iffy at the current
site.

As to why Crossville, Tennessee, I really have no idea. With all due respect to
Crossville, I think the search process should continue if that's the best place
they have come up with so far.

2) What is your position on the move ?


Based on what I have heard, I'm opposed to it. Apparently Crossville is two
hours from an airport and in the middle of nowhere. There is no local chess
constituency, which I think is important though I know others think
differently.

In Crossville, will it be easy or even possible to find highly qualified and
educated technical people, such as are required to run a top-notch website, a
large database and programming operation, and publish a high-quality magazine?
I don't know, but I am skeptical till proven wrong.

Moving to Crossville, Tennessee strikes me as yet one more significant
strategic mistake by USCF in a long string of strategic mistakes over the past
decade.

3) Do you feel a move to NY city might be a better place, due to Economies

of Scale and the ability to start a USCF chess club in NY and have 15 million
potential players

As I've said before, I think our national chess federation should be
headquartered in the Northeast, which has long been the geographic center of
chess in this country ... or in the Pacific Northwest, possibly involving
people from Yasser Seirawan's old International Chess Enterprises. That
crowd is already running the U.S. Chess Championship for USCF; the Northwest
is a hotbed for computer people and other highly skilled professionals; the
area also has a strong chess heritage.

Both the Northeast and the Northwest also have strong media and PR
capabilities. In either area you can call a press conference or hold a public
event and get a good turnout with plenty of professionals to manage
things. I doubt there is much of that capability in Crossville, Tennessee.

Tim Hanke
--
I am a candidate for the U.S. Chess Federation Executive Board in the 2003
election. Please visit my website at http://www.timothyhanke.net.


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Old October 24th 04, 10:24 AM
Duncan Oxley
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Smart people are not afraid to reevaluate their position when
new information comes in as time passes.

Clenched mouthed jerks call this flip-flopping.

If your heart surgeon decides you don't need an emergency operation
because he got wrong information and now new tests show different
would you wonder if he was right/wrong or wrong/right or thank your
lucky stars?

"Parrthenon" wrote in message
...
Tim Hanke cast the decisive vote to move to Crossville without delaying
the
vote for two weeks to explore whether a generous offer from a billionaire
philanthropist who lives near New Windsor was feasible. Recently he stated
he
wouldn't accept the Liberty site even if it was given to the USCF for
free.
However, a realtor's report submitted to the board before the vote was
taken
states that the site is worth in excess of $500,000!

As a candidate Mr. Hanke was opposed to Crossville. Was he right then and
wrong
now? Or wrong now and right then?

From: Tim Hanke )
Subject: Questions for T. Hanke & S. Sloan

rec.games.chess.misc, rec.games.chess.politics
Date: 2003-06-14 13:52:58 PST

"Gunny Bunny" wrote ...
1) Why is the USCF moving ? Especially to Tennessee ?


I believe the USCF is moving in large part to shed payroll without having
to
fire employees. The move can be expected to lead to many staff quitting
who
might otherwise have had to be fired. Also, morale has been iffy at the
current
site.

As to why Crossville, Tennessee, I really have no idea. With all due
respect to
Crossville, I think the search process should continue if that's the best
place
they have come up with so far.

2) What is your position on the move ?


Based on what I have heard, I'm opposed to it. Apparently Crossville is
two
hours from an airport and in the middle of nowhere. There is no local
chess
constituency, which I think is important though I know others think
differently.

In Crossville, will it be easy or even possible to find highly qualified
and
educated technical people, such as are required to run a top-notch
website, a
large database and programming operation, and publish a high-quality
magazine?
I don't know, but I am skeptical till proven wrong.

Moving to Crossville, Tennessee strikes me as yet one more significant
strategic mistake by USCF in a long string of strategic mistakes over the
past
decade.

3) Do you feel a move to NY city might be a better place, due to
Economies

of Scale and the ability to start a USCF chess club in NY and have 15
million
potential players

As I've said before, I think our national chess federation should be
headquartered in the Northeast, which has long been the geographic center
of
chess in this country ... or in the Pacific Northwest, possibly involving
people from Yasser Seirawan's old International Chess Enterprises. That
crowd is already running the U.S. Chess Championship for USCF; the
Northwest
is a hotbed for computer people and other highly skilled professionals;
the
area also has a strong chess heritage.

Both the Northeast and the Northwest also have strong media and PR
capabilities. In either area you can call a press conference or hold a
public
event and get a good turnout with plenty of professionals to manage
things. I doubt there is much of that capability in Crossville, Tennessee.

Tim Hanke
--
I am a candidate for the U.S. Chess Federation Executive Board in the 2003
election. Please visit my website at http://www.timothyhanke.net.




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Old October 24th 04, 02:20 PM
StanB
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Parrthenon" wrote in message
...

However, a realtor's report submitted to the board before the vote was
taken
states that the site is worth in excess of $500,000!


Realtors are right up there with car salesman, Sam Sloan, and guys in
singles bars when it comes to the truthfulness.


  #9   Report Post  
Old October 24th 04, 02:52 PM
Parrthenon
 
Posts: n/a
Default

ON FLIP FLOPS

Smart people are not afraid to reevaluate their position when new information
comes in as time passes. Clenched mouthed jerks call this flip-flopping. If
your heart surgeon decides you don't need an emergency operation because he got
wrong information and now new tests show different would you wonder if he was
right/wrong or wrong/right or thank your lucky stars? -- Duncan Oxley

But the new information was suppressed when the board voted not to wait two
more weeks. Does a heart surgeon start the operation when more tests are
needed?

Moving to Crossville, Tennessee strikes me as yet one more significant

strategic mistake by USCF in a long string of strategic mistakes over the past
decade. -- Candidate Tim Hanke in 2003

Some people voted for Tim Hanke on the basis of promises he made about his
opposition to Crossville. It was he -- not I -- who argued in the strongest
terms that it was a strategic mistake. He has still not explained his strange
about face and remains resolutely silent except to call Liberty "a money pit."

Perhaps Crossville was the best move, who knows? I have not argued otherwise.

But what was the justification for not delaying the vote just two more weeks
while another option was explored that would have kept the present staff on
board instead of pulling up stakes and leaving New York?

These questions remain unanswered. Those who ask these questions do so because
they care about the future of chess and the future of the USCF.

Did the board take all the facts into consideration? Did the majority make the
right decision by not waiting two more weeks?

So far the answers are clearly NO.

CPA Stan Booz even invented two whoppers about the Liberty building on a septic
tank and not being occupied for decades. When asked by Louis Blair and this
writer to explain the basis for these statements, he had no reply except to
insult both of us.

Why is it necessary for apologists to invent whoppers in order to justify a
dubious decision when all some board members wanted was just two more weeks
before taking a final vote? So far nobody has explained this to the
satisfaction of many members, which leads Sam Sloan and others to suspect a
hidden agenda here.

__________________________________________________ ______________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
  #10   Report Post  
Old October 24th 04, 03:01 PM
StanB
 
Posts: n/a
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"Parrthenon" wrote in message
...

CPA Stan Booz even invented two whoppers about the Liberty building on a
septic
tank and not being occupied for decades. When asked by Louis Blair and
this
writer to explain the basis for these statements, he had no reply except
to
insult both of us.


There's a whopper for you. I insulter neither. I didn't even reply to
Blair's post. He's on my blocked list as having low signal to noise ratio.


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