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Old June 22nd 05, 04:11 AM
Sam Sloan
 
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Default Expanding the USCF Tournament Archives

Expanding the USCF Tournament Archives

This is one of my pet projects which I hope to expand on if I am
elected.

In the last week, I have been having a heated argument with Randy
Bauer about our relative strengths. The problem is that he played most
of his chess in the 1980s and I played most of my chess in the 1960s.
Not only can we not compare with each other but the USCF MSA Database
does not start until 1991.

I would like to see major historical tournaments added to the USCF
online database. In particular, I would like to see every US Open
going back to 1900 (when it was called the Western Open) added to the
database.

My first idea was to get the USCF staff to type this all in. However,
now I have a better idea: Get volunteers to do it.

For example, I played in the US Open in 1959, 1960, 1964 and 1966. I
played in the US Junior in 1958, 1963 and 1964.

I have the cross tables for the US Open in 1959 and 1966. I would be
willing to volunteer to type in those cross tables myself.

One problem is that back then there were no USCF ID numbers. Probably
most of the players continued to play chess and later on got ID
numbers. I would have to look them up and for those players who
stopped playing perhaps a computer would assign them.

The next problem would be how to get the data I have entered into the
USCF online database. Mike Nolan would have to set up some procedure
hereby we volunteers could enter cross tables into the database. A
password system would have to be instituted. The games would be
unrated but still the results would be there. I am sure that over time
all the major USCF tournaments would get into the database and we
would greatly benefit as a result.

I would appreciate comments, especially from Mike Nolan.

On another subject, Bill Goichberg indicated that the 2004 World Chess
Olympiad in Spain would be USCF rated. Why was that not done?

I propose to allow foreign tournaments such as the Championship of
Iceland to be USCF rated as long as those countries are willing to pay
the USCF rating fees.

Sam Sloan
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Old June 22nd 05, 04:34 AM
[email protected]
 
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Bill Smythe might know this...I think that in the 1960's & early 70's,
the major international tnmts WERE USCF rated, & the ratings not
published. This was necessary to figure out Fischer's true rating.

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Old June 22nd 05, 04:51 AM
Matt Nemmers
 
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Sam Sloan wrote:
Expanding the USCF Tournament Archives

This is one of my pet projects which I hope to expand on if I am
elected.


SNIP

Better start saving your unemployment now then.

If you even want to *try* and DREAM of getting elected it won't be for
many years to come. *YOU* just getting this idea off the ground will
cost you (personally) at LEAST $1500.00 cold, hard kiz-ash. And this
is, of course, a very conservative estimate.

MN

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Old June 22nd 05, 05:06 AM
[email protected]
 
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I like Randy Bauer a lot as a member of the USCF Board, and although
our political and economic philosophies are probably light years apart,
I can appreciate expertise and success.

However, I reviewed the same record Sloan did on the MSA, and I would
consider how Bauer got to 2300 an "easy" approach. Was he master
strength? No doubt, but it was pretty obvious he hit 2300 on some soft
results..... But I have seen many people do worse... Certainly nothing
he did was immoral or against USCF rules....

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Old June 22nd 05, 05:19 AM
Randy Bauer
 
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wrote in message
ups.com...
I like Randy Bauer a lot as a member of the USCF Board, and although
our political and economic philosophies are probably light years apart,
I can appreciate expertise and success.

However, I reviewed the same record Sloan did on the MSA, and I would
consider how Bauer got to 2300 an "easy" approach. Was he master
strength? No doubt, but it was pretty obvious he hit 2300 on some soft
results..... But I have seen many people do worse... Certainly nothing
he did was immoral or against USCF rules....


I guess I don't understand what was soft about it? It sure didn't seem soft
to me. Here are the statistics:

72 games as a master, 4 losses, to a GM, an IM, a NM and one single solitary
1974 player. 19 games with draws, average rating 2173. The rest were wins,
for an 80% score.

I also scored 80% against experts +25 -2 =13.

In my last tournament, the US Amateur Team Midwest, I beat former and future
master Peter Stein (2193) as well as two experts rated 2054 and 2039. My
next to last tournament was the South Dakota Governor's Cup, which was won
by GMs Serper and Palatnik ahead of GMs Wolf and Kudrin (to whom I lost in
the 4th round). It also included 13 other masters, and besides losing to
Kudrin, I beat players rated 2124 and 1930 and drew a player rated 2153.

This stretch also includes an Ames Chess Festival where I tied for first
with NM Sharrafuddin ahead of NM Kevin Burnett and future NM Ilya Karasek.
It also includes a Waterloo tournament where I finished clear first ahead of
NMs Bob Jacobs (with whom I drew in the 4th round in a game
I should have won), NM Dan Harger, and future NM Ilya Karasek (who I beat in
the last round).

Also included is a Goichberg tournament in Kansas City where I finished in
the money but behind the winners, which included IM Mike Brooks, NM Jim
McLaughlin (I drew with him in the last round) and tied with NM Mark
Schiffner (we drew in round 4) and ahead of NMs Andrew Witte, Bob Jacobs,
Ken Thomas, Mark Bohannan, and Alan Piper (who I beat in the third round).

There are also 3 Iowa State Closed Championships. Twice I finished second
behind NM Kevin Burnett and once third behind Burnett and IM Martin Olesen
(in all three of those events I drew with Burnett in our game, and I also
drew with Olesen the year he finished ahead of me). There are also at least
2 tournaments where I finished second behind IM Mike Brooks. In half of the
tournaments I competed in as a master, I came in either first or second.

In short, there were lots of competitive tournaments with many strong
players. What, exactly, would you expect a 2300 player to do that I didn't
do?

Randy Bauer



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Old June 22nd 05, 05:27 AM
Paul Rubin
 
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"Randy Bauer" writes:
72 games as a master, 4 losses, to a GM, an IM, a NM and one single solitary
1974 player. 19 games with draws, average rating 2173. The rest were wins,
for an 80% score.


What was the average rating of the opponents in those 49 wins?
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Old June 22nd 05, 05:30 AM
Randy Bauer
 
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"Paul Rubin" wrote in message
...
"Randy Bauer" writes:
72 games as a master, 4 losses, to a GM, an IM, a NM and one single
solitary
1974 player. 19 games with draws, average rating 2173. The rest were
wins,
for an 80% score.


What was the average rating of the opponents in those 49 wins?


Oh, god, I've got to go back and do another calculation... I don't know,
Paul, but wouldn't the fact I scored 80% against experts in 40 games be more
relavent? I mean, you can't really choose your early round opponents (even
though Sloan suggests I did), but that's a pretty good score against
experts, don't you think?

How many 2200 players score 80% against experts?

Randy Bauer


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Old June 22nd 05, 05:52 AM
Paul Rubin
 
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"Randy Bauer" writes:
What was the average rating of the opponents in those 49 wins?


Oh, god, I've got to go back and do another calculation... I don't know,
Paul, but wouldn't the fact I scored 80% against experts in 40 games be more
relavent?


I'd say it shows you are very consistent at beating weaker players,
which is certainly nothing to sneeze at. I wouldn't give Sloan a
chance against you.

What it doesn't show is how you do against other 2300 players. You
mention 19 draws against average opposition rating of 2173, but the
distribution of those opponent ratings is not mentioned.

Anyway, someone who consistently beats 2100's while drawing other
2300's and losing to IM's is a legitimate 2300 player. Someone whose
results are less consistent, who is likely to both lose to a 2100 and
beat a GM in the same event, is also a legitimate 2300 player. One
could reasonably claim that a player who's won some occasional good
games against GM's has better stories to tell than some other player
of the same rating who only beats experts (but does it consistently).

So, you're asking what people are looking for in an impressive 2300
player. I'd look for: 1) the expectation that if you pick ten random
2300 players out of the ratings list and play a game against each one,
that you'll get about an even score; 2) Being able to occasionally
manage to play at a very high level, beating IM's or GM's in good
quality games where nobody messed up.

How many 2200 players score 80% against experts?


According to the USCF rating formula, a 2200 player should expect to
score about 76% against a 2000 player, if that's what you're asking.
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