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Old June 7th 08, 05:34 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?

When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.

As I played Rybka (5 sec / move) against Normal Level (100 sec / move)
and found both play equally well.

So when Rybka is playing at 5 sec / move is it playing with 3100
Strength? What is the time per move at which Rybka Rating equals 3100?

What are the Programs which Rank 2ns and 3rd and what is their
ratings?

Crafty, ChessMaster, Fritz who ranks first and what is rating of each?

What is the Rank of GetClub Chess in all engines?

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Old June 7th 08, 05:36 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?

When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.


And also Which Computer they Play to test the Rating?

Is it Celeron? Dual Core? Quad Core? or a Super Computer.

Since rating can be increased a lot by giving a good hardware.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html



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Old June 7th 08, 07:17 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

Sanny skrev:
I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?

When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.


And also Which Computer they Play to test the Rating?

Is it Celeron? Dual Core? Quad Core? or a Super Computer.

Since rating can be increased a lot by giving a good hardware.


Uhm, no. Rating of pure software chess engines is based on how they
perform on _equal_ grounds. That is they have the same hardware, same
time controls, same number of pieces on the board etc.

If I made a chess engine and said "hey, wow, my engine on a quad core
computer can beat Rybka on a Pentium classic most of the time if I give
my engine 2 hours per move versus Rybka 10 seconds per move, my engine
plays white all the time, and my engine starts with a queen up!" it
would mean exactly squat.
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Old June 7th 08, 08:43 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?


"Sanny" wrote in message
...
I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?


Possibly if you limit the results to solely computer vs. computer.

When you test only computer vs. computer, you can get some really screwed up
ratings that don't match well to what you'd get against humans.


When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.


I suppose that would depend on where you read people were saying it was at
that rating.

I wouldn't be surprised if that was some sort of blitz game, though.


As I played Rybka (5 sec / move) against Normal Level (100 sec / move)
and found both play equally well.

So when Rybka is playing at 5 sec / move is it playing with 3100


No.

Strength? What is the time per move at which Rybka Rating equals 3100?


You'd have to check into who was saying Rybka was 3100. It could be any
speed setting they were wanting to talk about.


What are the Programs which Rank 2ns and 3rd and what is their
ratings?

Crafty, ChessMaster, Fritz who ranks first and what is rating of each?


Current versions of Crafty are probably 200-250 points lower than Rybka.
And there are quite a few programs in between them.

Based on what I've seen on the web, Fritz might be less than a hundred
points lower than Rybka.

Not sure about ChessMaster.


What is the Rank of GetClub Chess in all engines?


Probably pretty darn low, since you seem determined not to let it play on
the free internet chess servers where it can play against people and
programs and actually get a reliable rating.


I mean really! If you want a reliable rating for your program, then the
best way is to let other people and programs play against it.

If you aren't willing to do that, then you probably already know your
program is under 1800, which even 8 bit micro's surpassed decades ago.





Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html





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Old June 7th 08, 08:49 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

"Sanny" wrote in message
...
I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?

When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.


And also Which Computer they Play to test the Rating?

Is it Celeron? Dual Core? Quad Core? or a Super Computer.


How should we know?

You are the one who read on the web that these programs had those ratings.

So, look on the web. Look for actual test results rather than somebody just
saying it or just playing a few games.


It could be any type of system. If it was done on an even tournament, then
possibly all of them were running on the same hardware.

If it was a normal tournmanet style test, then they could have been running
on any hardware they watned. You could have one running an old 32 bit
celeron laptop, while some other is running on a massive 256 core cluster
supercomputer.

So unless you know what hardware it was done on, and the time control
settings, those ratings could go up or down by 300 points or more.



Since rating can be increased a lot by giving a good hardware.


Sure. A fast 64 bit system is going to help a bitboard program a lot. It
wont help a mailbox program much, though.

If you force a bitboard program to run on a 32 bit system, then you've just
slowed the program down by half or so. (32 vs. 64 bits, plus the loss of
the extra registers)

So if those tests were all done on the same hardware, and it wasn't 64 bit,
then some programs could be at a serious disadvantage.




Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html








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Old June 7th 08, 09:01 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

"Morten Skarstad" `whoami`@localhost wrote in message
...
Sanny skrev:
I read on internet Rybka is 3100 rated. And Fritz is 2900 Rated is it
true?

When they say Rybka is 3100 Rated How much time they give it for each
Move.


And also Which Computer they Play to test the Rating?

Is it Celeron? Dual Core? Quad Core? or a Super Computer.

Since rating can be increased a lot by giving a good hardware.


Uhm, no. Rating of pure software chess engines is based on how they
perform on _equal_ grounds. That is they have the same hardware, same time
controls, same number of pieces on the board etc.


Depends on who's doing the tests.

If somebody is actually running those programs in their own tournament, then
they probably are going to do it on similar hardware. It could be whatever
they had. An antique Athlon, an even older 486, or a modern Core 2 Quad.
32 or 64 bit OS.

On the other hand, if this was done based on a chess server, then everybody
will be running their own programs on their own hardware. Which may or not
be their full strength tournament hardware. And you'll have all sorts of
hardware. A celeron laptop, an old spare P4, a dual core, a quad core, a
few spare cores on some cluster, etc.

So unless you know who did the tests and where the rating comes from, you
just don't know.


If I made a chess engine and said "hey, wow, my engine on a quad core
computer can beat Rybka on a Pentium classic most of the time if I give


If the Rybka author chose to use a pentium class, then that would be his
choice. And that rating would be valid.

It wouldn't be up to you to run it on that differeing hardware though.


my engine 2 hours per move versus Rybka 10 seconds per move, my engine
plays white all the time, and my engine starts with a queen up!" it would
mean exactly squat.






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Old June 8th 08, 06:30 AM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default Rating of GetClub???

Crafty, ChessMaster, Fritz who ranks first and what is rating of each?

What is the Rank of GetClub Chess in all engines?

Bye
Sanny


A few months back a few people used to testr GetClub against other
Chess Engines and used to say see how GetClub lost the game. But after
the GetClub Chess was improved they have just disappeared from the
group.


Any one having Fritz/ Chess Master/ Crafty etc can you play a few
games and let me know what is the rating of Beginner & Easy Levels at
GetClub Chess?

As per my estimates on my old computer

Beginner: 2000+
Easy: 2100+
Normal: 2200+
Master: 2300+

Do you all agree with above rating for GetClub Levels after the
improvements?

How many players here are 2300+ rated and can win the Master Level?

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html





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Old June 8th 08, 06:46 AM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

Strength? What is the time per move at which Rybka Rating equals 3100?

You'd have to check into who was saying Rybka was 3100. *It could be any
speed setting they were wanting to talk about.


Yes, I found that Rybka was playing Equivalent to 40 moves in 40
minutes on a Athlon 64 X2 4600+ (2.4 GHz)

http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/4040/index.html

It gave Rybka rating of 3129.

Does anyone have Rybka Program and tell me how it face the Normal
Level So that I may compute the correct Rating of GetClub on same
hardware.

1. Do not use dual / Quad core as GetClub do not take advantage of
multicores.
2. Do not allow Rybka to think in opponents time as it will slow down
GetClub.

Once that is done I will get correct Rating of GetClub Levels.

Normal Level plays in 80-120 sec / move.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html




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Old June 8th 08, 03:43 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default What is Rating of Rybka and other Programs?

"Sanny" wrote in message
...
Strength? What is the time per move at which Rybka Rating equals 3100?


You'd have to check into who was saying Rybka was 3100. It could be any
speed setting they were wanting to talk about.


Yes, I found that Rybka was playing Equivalent to 40 moves in 40
minutes on a Athlon 64 X2 4600+ (2.4 GHz)

http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/4040/index.html

It gave Rybka rating of 3129.


That's definetly computer vs. computer, so you need to take that rating with
a proverbial grain of salt.

In other words, it may be valid for that particular tournament, but it's not
representative of its rating against humans.

Does anyone have Rybka Program and tell me how it face the Normal
Level So that I may compute the correct Rating of GetClub on same
hardware.


Wont work.

To get a rating you have to play a lot more than just one program. Or even
few programs.

And you'll have to play lots of games to get a reasonable accuracy for your
program.

That's why I keep telling you that the fastest way for you to get a real
rating for your program is to modify your program so it can play on the
chess servers.

Either that or you will have to get a dozen or so programs or (better yet)
dedicated chess computers with fixed hardware and program versions that have
real ratings.

And then play hundreds of games.


As I said... it's easier if you do your program on the chess servers. And
it'll be more accurate and realistic.





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Old June 8th 08, 10:56 PM posted to rec.games.chess.misc,alt.chess,rec.games.chess.computer,rec.games.chess.politics
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Default Rating of GetClub???

Sanny wrote:
Crafty, ChessMaster, Fritz who ranks first and what is rating of each?

What is the Rank of GetClub Chess in all engines?


Best guess at tournament rates of play about 2000 on a good day.
(engines might still kill it stone dead. humans make unforced mistakes)

A few months back a few people used to testr GetClub against other
Chess Engines and used to say see how GetClub lost the game. But after
the GetClub Chess was improved they have just disappeared from the
group.


Any one having Fritz/ Chess Master/ Crafty etc can you play a few
games and let me know what is the rating of Beginner & Easy Levels at
GetClub Chess?

As per my estimates on my old computer

Beginner: 2000+
Easy: 2100+
Normal: 2200+
Master: 2300+

Do you all agree with above rating for GetClub Levels after the
improvements?


No. For heavens sake!

Bind the damn thing as a UCI engine and let people test it in engine vs
engine tournaments. Your estimated strength is about 300-400 points too
high and 1000 points too high in the endgame.

Until you declare how the search depth scales with increasing time it is
impossible to answer this question! State of the art engines currently
can manage almost an extra ply of search for doubling the time. Compared
to a basic alpha-beta of 6x time increase per extra ply.

What does yours do?

How many players here are 2300+ rated and can win the Master Level?


Not quite at that level but not interested in playing Getclub. It would
take far too loonnngggg. It is amusing to analyse its failings though.
Helpbots patience is admirable.

Regards,
Martin Brown
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