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Old May 21st 10, 03:19 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles
by Stefan Zweig
Foreword by Sam Sloan

She was born to be Queen of Scotland, she was briefly the Queen of
France and she had a claim to being Queen of England, which resulted
in her having her head chopped off.

They chopped off her head after she was found guilty of conspiring to
have Queen Elizabeth (1533-1603) assassinated so that she could take
power. Had she not been executed she would eventually have become
Queen of England when Elizabeth died.

That was only one of the many controversies in which she was involved.
Her first husband, who became the King of France, making her the
Queen, died shortly thereafter and her second husband was found
murdered, apparently strangled. Mary Queen of Scots (1542-1587) was
believed to have been complicit in that murder. Her Father, King James
V of Scotland (1512-1542), had many, many mistresses and possibly as
many as twenty illegitimate children. His father too, King James IV of
Scotland (1473-1513), had a similar number of mistresses and a similar
number of illegitimate children. This has left, to this day, the
problem genealogists have in sorting out all of these ******* kids.

I have this problem in my own family too. I have a presumed ancestor
named Mary Stuart, born 1729 in Gabinheough, Tyrone, Ireland. She was
said to have been descended from one of the ******* offspring of King
James IV or King James V of Scotland, but nobody has found evidence
for this relationship, and many have searched.

When father of Mary Queen of Scots, King James V of Scotland
(1512-1542), died just after a battle when Mary was only six days old,
Mary became Queen, not by being the eldest child but by being the only
legitimate child, as her mother Marie de Guise (1515-1560) was the
only legal wife of the King. The ******* children of King James V,
although older, did not get to rule.

Later, her only son, who became King James I of England as well as
King James VI of Scotland (1566-1625), thereby uniting England and
Scotland into one kingdom, was taken away from her shortly after his
birth and she never saw him again.

This widely acclaimed biography by Stefan Zweig is regarded as the
best of the many biographies of this famous woman.

The great thing about the author, Stefan Zweig, is that his
biographies are smooth and easy to read. By contrast, there is a
weighty tome with exactly the same title but 880 pages long. Here in
356 easy to read pages you can learn everything about Mary Queen of
Scots that you will probably ever want to know.

The way I remember the confusing but important facts of this
tumultuous period is that I remember that King James I was a
Protestant, because under him the King James Version of the Bible was
authorized and composed. The King James Version is a Protestant Bible.
The Catholics have a different Bible. Therefore, King James I must
have been a Protestant. I remember his era because Jamestown, the
First Permanent Settlement in North America, was established during
his rule.

His mother, Mary Queen of Scots, was a Catholic. Since Catholics do
not recognize divorce, she was the rightful Queen of England under the
Catholic System of counting. Therefore, her rival, Queen Elizabeth,
had to be Protestant if she wanted to remain Queen. The mother of
Elizabeth, Anne Boleyn (1501-1536), had her head chopped off because
her husband, King Henry VIII (1491-1547), wanted another wife.
However, when he again tired of the next wife too, he decided that it
would be bloody inconvenient to chop her head off too, so he changed
the Religion of England, abolishing Catholicism and establishing the
Church of England in its place. This change in religion enabled King
Henry VIII simply to divorce his next wife. He did not have to kill
that one.

The author, Stefan Zweig (born November 28, 1881, Vienna, Austria –
died February 22, 1942, Petrópolis, Brazil), was an Austrian novelist,
playwright, journalist and biographer was one of the most successful
and popular authors of the 20th Century. Although he wrote in German,
his works were translated into English and several other languages.
Zweig was a prolific writer. In the 1930s he was one of the most
widely translated authors in the world. His extensive travels led him
to India, Africa, North and Central America, and Russia.
This book was first published in 1935 in Frankfurt, Germany in German
as Maria Stuart.
There is a tragedy associated with this book, because the author and
his wife died by suicide. He left a suicide note stating that he and
his wife were killing themselves because he was in despair because his
native country, Austria, had been overrun by the Nazis.
However, that was not a good reason for suicide, as he was safely in
Brazil and Austria had been taken by the Nazis years earlier.
Perhaps another reason for his suicide was he had lost his royalty
income due to the “Trading with the Enemies Act”. His books were all
first published in Germany. Under the Trading with the Enemies Act, it
was illegal for any US company to pay money to any German company.
Austria had by then been annexed by Germany and was therefore part of
Germany. Therefore, the distributors of his books were prohibited from
paying money to his publishers who, in turn, could not pay him.
This seems monumentally unfair to Zweig, as Zweig was Jewish. Life is
unfair.
Although one can sort-of understand why Stefan Zweig might commit
suicide, one cannot understand why he entered into a suicide pact with
his new wife so that they would both die together. She was only 33
years old and had everything to live for. He was 27 years older. They
had a nice apartment and a good life in Brazil. They took poison
together and dead bodies were found by a housekeeper with their arms
wrapped around each other.
Strangely, at the peak of his popularity and having just completed his
autobiography while still working on four other books, Zweig committed
suicide in Brazil with his new wife by them both taking poison. In
1939, he had married Charlotte Altmann, his secretary from 1933. She
was twenty-seven years his junior.
Zweig left a suicide note stating that he had done so because of the
Nazi takeover of his country of Austria and because Europe was
destroying itself with World War II that was taking place.
This does not seem like a good reason for suicide and why did he take
his new wife, aged only 33, with him?

Sam Sloan
New York NY
May 21, 2010

ISBN 4-87187-858-9
978-4-87187-858-6

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo...SBN=4871878589
http://www.amazon.com/dp/4871878589
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Old May 21st 10, 12:31 PM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

On 21/05/10 03:19, samsloan wrote:
Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles


His mother, Mary Queen of Scots, was a Catholic. Since Catholics do
not recognize divorce, she was the rightful Queen of England under the
Catholic System of counting. Therefore, her rival, Queen Elizabeth,
had to be Protestant if she wanted to remain Queen.


I have news.

The Church of England doesn't recognise divorce either.

Henry didn't divorce her.

--
William Black

These are the gilded popinjays and murderous assassins of Perfidious
Albion and they are about their Queen's business. Any man who impedes
their passage does so at his own peril.

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Old May 21st 10, 01:12 PM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

samsloan wrote:
Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles




His mother, Mary Queen of Scots, was a Catholic. Since Catholics do
not recognize divorce, she was the rightful Queen of England under the
Catholic System of counting. Therefore, her rival, Queen Elizabeth,
had to be Protestant if she wanted to remain Queen. The mother of
Elizabeth, Anne Boleyn (1501-1536), had her head chopped off because
her husband, King Henry VIII (1491-1547), wanted another wife.
However, when he again tired of the next wife too, he decided that it
would be bloody inconvenient to chop her head off too, so he changed
the Religion of England, abolishing Catholicism and establishing the
Church of England in its place. This change in religion enabled King
Henry VIII simply to divorce his next wife. He did not have to kill
that one.



Your chronology and facts are wrong. Henry VIII had to distance himself
from the Pope and the Catholic Church in order to divorce his first
wife, Katharine of Aragon. Ann Boleyn's head was not severed from her
body because Henry wanted "another wife". He wanted a son and Boleyn had
just miscarried a son. Henry did not abolish Catholicism. He remained a
devout Catholic for the rest of his life. He just didn't answer to the
Pope. It was a kind of cusp period in the development of the Church of
England. He didn't divorce his next wife. She died. He had his
penultimate marriage annulled, because he thought his blushing bride
looked like a "Flanders mare". He took one look at her and sent her
packing. She outlived him as did his last wife.
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Old May 21st 10, 07:33 PM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves, but she was not his
penultimate wife. His penultimate wife was Catherine Howard, whom he
had beheaded for treason (adultery by the wife of the king was
treason). His last wife, Catherine Parr, did outlive him.

CE Wood

On May 21, 5:12*am, Renia wrote:
samsloan wrote:


snip
He had his penultimate marriage annulled, because he thought his blushing bride
looked like a "Flanders mare". He took one look at her and sent her
packing. She outlived him as did his last wife.


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Old May 21st 10, 10:34 PM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

CE Wood wrote:
He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves, but she was not his



Their marriage was annulled.


penultimate wife. His penultimate wife was Catherine Howard, whom he


Yup, sorry, missed one out.


had beheaded for treason (adultery by the wife of the king was
treason). His last wife, Catherine Parr, did outlive him.

CE Wood

On May 21, 5:12 am, Renia wrote:
samsloan wrote:


snip
He had his penultimate marriage annulled, because he thought his blushing bride
looked like a "Flanders mare". He took one look at her and sent her
packing. She outlived him as did his last wife.




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Old May 22nd 10, 12:52 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

On 21/05/10 19:33, CE Wood wrote:
He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves,


Nope.

Annulled.

He never even got her into bed...

--
William Black

These are the gilded popinjays and murderous assassins of Perfidious
Albion and they are about their Queen's business. Any man who impedes
their passage does so at his own peril.

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Old May 22nd 10, 12:53 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

On 21/05/10 23:48, Fred J. McCall wrote:
CE wrote:

He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves, but she was not his
penultimate wife. His penultimate wife was Catherine Howard, whom he
had beheaded for treason (adultery by the wife of the king was
treason). His last wife, Catherine Parr, did outlive him.


Reminds me of the little rhyme we learned in school to keep track of
all this - divorced, beheaded, died; divorced, beheaded, survived.



He never divorced any of his wives.

They decided that his first marriage was never legal and the fourth was
never consummated.


--
William Black

These are the gilded popinjays and murderous assassins of Perfidious
Albion and they are about their Queen's business. Any man who impedes
their passage does so at his own peril.

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Old May 22nd 10, 07:44 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles


Your chronology and facts are wrong. Henry VIII had to distance himself
from the Pope and the Catholic Church in order to divorce his first
wife, Katharine of Aragon.


It had more to do with international power politics than religion.
Catharine's nephew the Emperor Charles V captured Rome. The resulting
peace treaty included a marriage alliance between between the papal
and imperial families, the return of a few towns to the Pope that had
been taken by Henry's ally Venice, and the establishment of a duchy
for the papal dynasty in Florence. In return, the pope was to refuse
to annul Henry's marriage to the Emperor's aunt. Henry's reaction was
to call a general election, and the English people, enraged by an
Italian prince's inference in English affairs, elected a House of
Commons that was determined to reform the corrupt church.
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Old May 22nd 10, 11:24 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

Fred J. McCall wrote:
William Black wrote:

On 21/05/10 23:48, Fred J. McCall wrote:
CE wrote:

He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves, but she was not his
penultimate wife. His penultimate wife was Catherine Howard, whom he
had beheaded for treason (adultery by the wife of the king was
treason). His last wife, Catherine Parr, did outlive him.

Reminds me of the little rhyme we learned in school to keep track of
all this - divorced, beheaded, died; divorced, beheaded, survived.


He never divorced any of his wives.

They decided that his first marriage was never legal and the fourth was
never consummated.


Willie, the difference between 'divorced' (not legal) and annulled was
a big check to the Pope...


Not at all, or at least, not only. And the differences between divorce
and anullment had enormous importance. An annullment meant that the
'marriage' had never existed - which meant that any children born of it
were merely illegitimate and therefore had no legal claim on the throne.
A divorce meant that the marriage really had existed, and all the claims
of the children remained valid. Whether or not you believed that any
power on earth, from the Pope to the local secular law, could end a
legally-constituted marriage (that is, pronounce a divorce), the
difference between a divorce and an anullment meant a lot, especially in
a period in which the children of a marriage stood to lose so much from
their parents' annullment.

--
Cheryl
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Old May 22nd 10, 11:59 AM posted to soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval,soc.culture.scottish,rec.games.chess.politics,soc.history
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Default Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles

On 22/05/10 04:48, Fred J. McCall wrote:
William wrote:

On 21/05/10 23:48, Fred J. McCall wrote:
CE wrote:

He did divorce his fourth wife, Anne of Cleves, but she was not his
penultimate wife. His penultimate wife was Catherine Howard, whom he
had beheaded for treason (adultery by the wife of the king was
treason). His last wife, Catherine Parr, did outlive him.


Reminds me of the little rhyme we learned in school to keep track of
all this - divorced, beheaded, died; divorced, beheaded, survived.



He never divorced any of his wives.

They decided that his first marriage was never legal and the fourth was
never consummated.


Willie, the difference between 'divorced' (not legal) and annulled was
a big check to the Pope...


Goodness no.

Annulled means the children weren't legitimate...

I know the subtleties of English constitutional law are usually beyond
you but if the first wife has a kid and that kid is then declared a
******* it makes inheritance of the thrown much more... entertaining...

Especially if the first one isn't the same religion as the second one
and they're still burning people over minor theosophical issues...

--
William Black

These are the gilded popinjays and murderous assassins of Perfidious
Albion and they are about their Queen's business. Any man who impedes
their passage does so at his own peril.

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