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Old October 3rd 11, 04:46 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.politics,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Default Soviet School of Chess, looking for the complete games

On Oct 3, 1:33*am, "Andrew B." wrote:
On Sep 28, 11:16*pm, ChessFire wrote:

They do say: "It is stated, for example, *that the growth of the
Soviet School took place immediately after the October revolution in
1917; in actual fact it was not until 1934, when the leading Soviet
players began venturing to tournaments in other countries, that the
USSR was recognised as any sort of chess power at all. As late as 1940
there were only 5 international grandmasters in the Soviet Union."


Did "international grandmaster" even mean anything before 1950?


Technically, no, since the title was first officially awarded in
1950. I supposed the writer meant that in 1940 there were only five
Soviet masters playing at a GM level. But even that doesn't fit, as at
that time Botvinnik, Keres, Smyslov, Boleslavsky, Levenfish,
Bondarevsky, Lilienthal, Kotov and probably others were GM strength.
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Old October 3rd 11, 06:32 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.politics,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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Default Soviet School of Chess, looking for the complete games

On Oct 3, 8:46*am, Taylor Kingston wrote:
On Oct 3, 1:33*am, "Andrew B." wrote:

On Sep 28, 11:16*pm, ChessFire wrote:


They do say: "It is stated, for example, *that the growth of the
Soviet School took place immediately after the October revolution in
1917; in actual fact it was not until 1934, when the leading Soviet
players began venturing to tournaments in other countries, that the
USSR was recognised as any sort of chess power at all. As late as 1940
there were only 5 international grandmasters in the Soviet Union."


Did "international grandmaster" even mean anything before 1950?


* Technically, no, since the title was first officially awarded in
1950. I supposed the writer meant that in 1940 there were only five
Soviet masters playing at a GM level. But even that doesn't fit, as at
that time Botvinnik, Keres, Smyslov, Boleslavsky, Levenfish,
Bondarevsky, Lilienthal, Kotov and probably others were GM strength.


You are overlooking the many very strong players in the Soviet Union
that we do not know about because they never got out of the Soviet
Union to play against us.

Most are unknown in the West or are only known because they have
openings named after them.

Also, many died at early ages in the wars and purges in the Soviet
Union. Riumin, for example, was considered equal to Botvinnik.

Here are a few names:

Ilyin-Zhenevsky
S Belavenets
Rabinovich
V Kirilov
Verlinsky
Veresov
Riumin
Rauzer

Sam Sloan
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Old October 3rd 11, 08:47 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.politics,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2011
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Default Soviet School of Chess, looking for the complete games

On Oct 3, 10:32*am, samsloan wrote:
On Oct 3, 8:46*am, Taylor Kingston wrote:





On Oct 3, 1:33*am, "Andrew B." wrote:


On Sep 28, 11:16*pm, ChessFire wrote:


They do say: "It is stated, for example, *that the growth of the
Soviet School took place immediately after the October revolution in
1917; in actual fact it was not until 1934, when the leading Soviet
players began venturing to tournaments in other countries, that the
USSR was recognised as any sort of chess power at all. As late as 1940
there were only 5 international grandmasters in the Soviet Union."


Did "international grandmaster" even mean anything before 1950?


* Technically, no, since the title was first officially awarded in
1950. I supposed the writer meant that in 1940 there were only five
Soviet masters playing at a GM level. But even that doesn't fit, as at
that time Botvinnik, Keres, Smyslov, Boleslavsky, Levenfish,
Bondarevsky, Lilienthal, Kotov and probably others were GM strength.


You are overlooking the many very strong players in the Soviet Union
that we do not know about


Eh? If we do not know about them, then we can do nothing but
overlook them. However, any deserving GM-level player I did not
mention can be considered as included in "and probably others were GM
strength."

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Old October 4th 11, 08:25 AM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.politics,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: Mar 2007
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Default Soviet School of Chess, looking for the complete games

On 3 oct, 12:46, Taylor Kingston wrote:
On Oct 3, 1:33*am, "Andrew B." wrote:

On Sep 28, 11:16*pm, ChessFire wrote:


They do say: "It is stated, for example, *that the growth of the
Soviet School took place immediately after the October revolution in
1917; in actual fact it was not until 1934, when the leading Soviet
players began venturing to tournaments in other countries, that the
USSR was recognised as any sort of chess power at all. As late as 1940
there were only 5 international grandmasters in the Soviet Union."


Did "international grandmaster" even mean anything before 1950?


* Technically, no, since the title was first officially awarded in
1950. I supposed the writer meant that in 1940 there were only five
Soviet masters playing at a GM level. But even that doesn't fit, as at
that time Botvinnik, Keres, Smyslov, Boleslavsky, Levenfish,
Bondarevsky, Lilienthal, Kotov and probably others were GM strength.


As you know the USSR created the grandmaster title in 1935, the first
was Botvinnik.

Soviet grandmasters:

Botvinnik: 1935
Levenfish: 1937
Kotov:1939
Bondarevsky: 1940
Lilienthal: 1940
Keres: 1941
Smyslov: 1941
Flohr: 1942
Boleslavsky: 1945
Ragozin: 1946
Bronstein: 1948
Averbakh: 1952 (=IGM)
Geller: 1952 (=IGM)
Petrosian: 1952 (=IGM)
Taimanov: 1952 (=IGM)
Tolush: 1953 (=IGM)
Korchnoi: 1956 (=IGM)
Spassky: 1956 (=IGM)
Tal: 1957 (=IGM)
Polugaevsky: 1960
Kholmov: 1960 (=IGM)
Vasiukov: 1961 (=IGM)

Then FIDE copied the title system.

The rest of the names mentioned are not grandmasters but have a
different title:

Ilyin-Zhenevsky: Master of Sport, 1925
Belavenets: Master of Sport, 1933
Abram Rabinovich: Master of Sport, 1909
Ilya Rabinovich: Master of Sport, 1914
Kirillov: Master of Sport, 1958
Verlinsky: Master of Sport, 1924
Veresov: Master of Sport, 1937
Riumin: Master of Sport, 1931
Rauzer: Master of Sport, 1929
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Old October 4th 11, 05:42 PM posted to rec.games.chess.analysis,rec.games.chess.misc,rec.games.chess.politics,rec.games.chess.computer,alt.chess
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First recorded activity by ChessBanter: May 2011
Posts: 1,329
Default Soviet School of Chess, looking for the complete games

On Oct 4, 12:25*am, Chvsanchez wrote:
On 3 oct, 12:46, Taylor Kingston wrote:





On Oct 3, 1:33*am, "Andrew B." wrote:


On Sep 28, 11:16*pm, ChessFire wrote:


They do say: "It is stated, for example, *that the growth of the
Soviet School took place immediately after the October revolution in
1917; in actual fact it was not until 1934, when the leading Soviet
players began venturing to tournaments in other countries, that the
USSR was recognised as any sort of chess power at all. As late as 1940
there were only 5 international grandmasters in the Soviet Union."


Did "international grandmaster" even mean anything before 1950?


* Technically, no, since the title was first officially awarded in
1950. I supposed the writer meant that in 1940 there were only five
Soviet masters playing at a GM level. But even that doesn't fit, as at
that time Botvinnik, Keres, Smyslov, Boleslavsky, Levenfish,
Bondarevsky, Lilienthal, Kotov and probably others were GM strength.


As you know the USSR created the grandmaster title in 1935,


But that title of "Grandmaster of the USSR" or some such, not /
international/ grandmaster.

the first
was Botvinnik.


According to Bronstein ("The Sorcerer's Apprentice," 1995) the first
to get that title was actually Boris Verlinsky. Bronstein claims it
was taken away from Verlinsky on some pretext just to further glorify
Botvinnik by making him "the first."

Soviet grandmasters:

Botvinnik: 1935
Levenfish: 1937
Kotov:1939
Bondarevsky: 1940
Lilienthal: 1940


Perhaps these are the five referred to in the Dover preface to "The
Soviet School of Chess."

Keres: 1941
Smyslov: 1941
Flohr: 1942
Boleslavsky: 1945
Ragozin: 1946
Bronstein: 1948
Averbakh: 1952 (=IGM)
Geller: 1952 (=IGM)
Petrosian: 1952 (=IGM)
Taimanov: 1952 (=IGM)
Tolush: 1953 (=IGM)
Korchnoi: 1956 (=IGM)
Spassky: 1956 (=IGM)
Tal: 1957 (=IGM)
Polugaevsky: 1960
Kholmov: 1960 (=IGM)
Vasiukov: 1961 (=IGM)

Then FIDE copied the title system.

The rest of the names mentioned are not grandmasters but have a
different title:

Ilyin-Zhenevsky: Master of Sport, 1925
Belavenets: Master of Sport, 1933
Abram Rabinovich: Master of Sport, 1909
Ilya Rabinovich: Master of Sport, 1914
Kirillov: Master of Sport, 1958
Verlinsky: Master of Sport, 1924
Veresov: Master of Sport, 1937
Riumin: Master of Sport, 1931
Rauzer: Master of Sport, 1929- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


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