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Old July 4th 04, 01:15 PM
Sam Sloan
 
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Default How much are "Open Book Odds" worth?

A common misconception weak players have is that they are weak and the
strong players are strong only because the strong players have
memorized more opening book lines.

In the game of Scrabble, it is common for strong players to offer weak
players "Dictionary Odds". Players who are not good at scrabble are
allowed to look up words in the dictionary, which the strong player
cannot do.

It turns out that dictionary odds are worth very little in scrabble.

I have never seen this done but in chess I am prepared to offer
opening book odds. I will alow my opponent to bring any chess opening
book to the board, and he will be allowed to look up any opening in
the book and play any more he finds there.

Since I play off-beat openings not found in any book, I will give the
added stipulation that I will only play standard normal openings found
in MCO and other standard works.

The question is: How much is this worth?

I believe that this will be worth about 100 rating points, not more.
In other words, a 1700 player will play equal to an 1800 player with
these odds.

Sorry, but you 1700 players out there will not play like a grandmaster
even with these odds.

Sam Sloan
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Old July 4th 04, 01:55 PM
HAASpittle
 
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Default How much are "Open Book Odds" worth?

"Sorry, but you 1700 players out there will not play like a grandmaster even
with these odds." (Sam Sloan)
============
I think you are pretty much right about this sort of thing. Once we've
played the game for a few years, we are all pretty much stuck at whatever
becomes our general playing level.

RSHaas
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Old July 6th 04, 05:32 AM
Jerry Spinrad
 
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Default How much are "Open Book Odds" worth?

There are 2 somewhat different subcases to consider. In one case, A
plays B, and both know B will use a book. In a second case, A plays B,
and A doesn't know that B is using a book (a basic form of computer
cheating).

I play lines which are known to be busted quite frequently, figuring
opponents will not know the long,dangerous looking, obscure lines.
However, if I run into these lines unexpectedly, I am really quite far
down in the game. I would never go into these lines if I knew my
opponent had a book.

My guess is that having a book in the first situation is worth less
than 100 points, while in the second case it varies very much by how
sound player A's opening lines are. On average at amateur levels, the
second case is worth more than 100 points (my guess only of course).

Interesting ethical question on how to test the 2 cases. The easiest
way is to play on the computer with book, alternately telling
opponents/not telling that you are using a book. Doesn't seem to
ethical, however. Of course, according to Mr Bibuld, Sam is a "moral
bacillus", so maybe it won't tarnish his soul much to try this out!

Jerry Spinrad

(Sam Sloan) wrote in message ...
A common misconception weak players have is that they are weak and the
strong players are strong only because the strong players have
memorized more opening book lines.

In the game of Scrabble, it is common for strong players to offer weak
players "Dictionary Odds". Players who are not good at scrabble are
allowed to look up words in the dictionary, which the strong player
cannot do.

It turns out that dictionary odds are worth very little in scrabble.

I have never seen this done but in chess I am prepared to offer
opening book odds. I will alow my opponent to bring any chess opening
book to the board, and he will be allowed to look up any opening in
the book and play any more he finds there.

Since I play off-beat openings not found in any book, I will give the
added stipulation that I will only play standard normal openings found
in MCO and other standard works.

The question is: How much is this worth?

I believe that this will be worth about 100 rating points, not more.
In other words, a 1700 player will play equal to an 1800 player with
these odds.

Sorry, but you 1700 players out there will not play like a grandmaster
even with these odds.

Sam Sloan

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Old July 6th 04, 07:46 AM
Angelo DePalma
 
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Default How much are "Open Book Odds" worth?


Sam,

You're a ****ty player, about my strength. You couldn't offer a C player
"dictionary" odds and neither could I, even though I now own not one but
THREE pair of "chess glasses."

You'd be losing at move 12 90% of the time. Very bad odds. Go find Win Moe,
dude. Convert him to Islam.

adp


"Sam Sloan" wrote in message
...
A common misconception weak players have is that they are weak and the
strong players are strong only because the strong players have
memorized more opening book lines.

In the game of Scrabble, it is common for strong players to offer weak
players "Dictionary Odds". Players who are not good at scrabble are
allowed to look up words in the dictionary, which the strong player
cannot do.

It turns out that dictionary odds are worth very little in scrabble.

I have never seen this done but in chess I am prepared to offer
opening book odds. I will alow my opponent to bring any chess opening
book to the board, and he will be allowed to look up any opening in
the book and play any more he finds there.

Since I play off-beat openings not found in any book, I will give the
added stipulation that I will only play standard normal openings found
in MCO and other standard works.

The question is: How much is this worth?

I believe that this will be worth about 100 rating points, not more.
In other words, a 1700 player will play equal to an 1800 player with
these odds.

Sorry, but you 1700 players out there will not play like a grandmaster
even with these odds.

Sam Sloan



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